Warrior Tanking

[Nalou]

Wrath, as it is today, is barely a playstyle or a mechanic. Would you do BB and SP combos without wrath ? Yes, you would because you need to build aggro and get that 10% DR on the mob.

Wrath as it is now, is only a way to prevent us from spamming IB and SC. We would juste play the same way if IB and SC shared a single 20s coodown. Wrath is a cooldown in disguise, nothing more, nothing less.

Really, in terms of gameplay (mechanics) and freedom to adjust how you deal with stuff (playstyle), wrath as it is now, does little to nothing, because we're not choosing between building or spending wrath, for different benefits.


And yes, War 2.0 was meant to be reactive, because it was centered around using IB to recover from a big blow, and using abilities like Vengeance and Berserk to finish a 5 stack faster in order to recover (which implied some little management). Thrill of Battle aside, warrior had no proactive CD to pop to anticipate incoming blows and ToB is double-edged because it can also be used to recover.

Paladin was more proactive, with a ton of CDs to pop before damage, and a single one to recover: Convalescence.

[Hitokirinomad]

And yes, War 2.0 was meant to be reactive, because it was centered around using IB to recover from a big blow, and using abilities like Vengeance and Berserk to finish a 5 stack faster in order to recover (which implied some little management). Thrill of Battle aside, warrior had no proactive CD to pop to anticipate incoming blows and ToB is double-edged because it can also be used to recover.

Now you've lost me. Foresight, Featherfoot, Vengeance, Berserk are all (even in 2.0) proactive skills. You weren't using them to counter something the enemy HAD done, you used it ahead of time. I already said ToB could be proactive or reactive. Inner Beast is one skill that's not even Warrior exclusive(big hit + self heal? hrm...Life Surge). The only thing exclusive to Warrior is Wrath.

I'm not even sure why you continue to say if IB and SC were cooldowns nothing would change, because right now, IB and SC aren't on 20 sec cooldowns. It's an either/or situation, with Unchained in the mix. How would NOT having to make that choice of what to spend stacks on not fundamentally change the nature of the class? Because you still use Butcher'S Block?

[Nalou]

Foresight, Featherfoot, Vengeance, Berserk are all (even in 2.0) proactive skills.

Yes, but defensively speaking they are (were) really weak. You don't pop Foresight to mitigate a table flip or a Spaceship crash.

How is managing Wrath not WAR's playstyle?

Well if you call this "managing" then it's probably better if we quit this discussion because we'll never agree.

[Skull_Angel]

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I'm not sure what you're motioning at with your reply to Hitokirinomad; (unless you were geared out in 2.0) Inner Beast was a very weak ability as well, it required you to use Berserk and/or RNG (critical) to be a decent reactive self-heal. Yes, WAR's native abilities were (and Foresight and Bloodbath arguably still are) weak as well, but they were still part of the tool set.

Without properly "managing" your Wrath you could(2.0)/can(2.1) not properly utilize the strong abilities attached to it. Full Wrath isn't magically there when you need it, the enemy doesn't give it to you before it decides to use it's tank wrecking ability, you need to make sure it is available when it's needed; this has always been the core of WAR in ARR.

[Skull_Angel]

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How is managing Wrath not WAR's playstyle? "How do I want to build Warth?: How immediately do I need a full stack? Can I casually build it? Go through your combos. Do I need it very soon? Am I at more than 3 stacks with a Wrath combo ability pre-loaded and/or Berserk ready (or will I not need Vengeance soon?)? Use preloaded combo ability and/or pop Berserk (or Vengeance). Am I at less then 3 stacks and need to use IB/SS now? Pop Infuriate. Am I at full Wrath and don't need to use it now, but soon? Sit on it unless you Infuriate is ready and you won't need it in the foreseeable future."

WAR only had one really reactive ability (arguably 2 if ToB was beneficial to use after the fact) in 2.0 and it relied on wrath management; it was also pretty weak w/o buffs and relied heavily on gear. WAR also had/has 2 proactive abilities (Foresight and Bloodbath) and 3 Wrath management abilities (Infuriate, Vengeance and Berserk).