Warrior Tanking

[Zegreiart]

Why would the fire that made you write this guide extinguish within a month?

I can only give you my opinion on the matter. I signed up to be a warrior because self healing appealed to me quite a bit. It wasn't great, and it needed lots of work, but I was willing to ride the storm in hopes that they'd take the time to actually make it work with %HP returns, or absorbs, or something! However, I eventually decided that I didn't want to wait another month or so because I had selected the wrong class at start, only to hear, and then experience, that it was paladin or bust, so I quit in October and only came back a few days ago to see these changes.

What I got was a bandaid fix (granted it works, don't get me wrong) that makes me feel like paladin v2.0. After a few days of playing (NEET here, so by playing, I mean lots of it) I don't have that same drive I used to. First time I hit IB, I was dismayed by it. I expected that somewhat large number to pop up. Did I get it? Nope. Saw a nifty little buff for 20% damage reduction that lasts 6 or so seconds. I thought, "hey, not bad!" Then I started thinking about it and looked at my other abilities and how they were changed up or left alone.

I saw the SP buff and thought it was great, but I still don't understand why it gives such a pittance of healing. I looked at Bloodbath, nothing happened there. So I fired up the patch notes and spent an hour or so looking over everything and doing some thinking. Eventually I came to the conclusion that I should have just leveled a paladin. Nothing we do is unique compared to them. We stepped into their territory, giving up identity for a quick (and easy) fix.

As much as they want a thriving game (and I do too), this is borderline unacceptable to me. %HP returns, absorption, anything like that would have made me happy. Because of the identity of the class. I want to really dig in and get into the game, but it's ridiculously hard for me to do when I feel like another class in different gear mechanically. IB is our lifeline. It is the one thing we can reliably do to handle predictable burst. During beta when I saw all the small bits of self healing and such, I was excited. I was impressed another company wanted to have diversity in their tanks (especially since there's only two).

It'd take lots of work (more than SE apparently cares to do, but that's just me upset about it). I have plenty of ideas that'll never see the light of day to make it work, genuinely because I feel SE is very happy where things are. At this rate, I'm not sure I really want to wait on another tanking class and hope it's not only different, but has actual effort put into making it work so it doesn't step on the toes of paladins.

Warriors have a very fun kit to use, but mechanically, I'd rather just play a paladin instead. That said, I won't because their kit looks boring as hell with neat effects tied to them. I mean, not seriously anyway. Might level one up so I can see the CDs, effects, and how their abilities work so I can just draw up a way to make self healing work for a warrior treating returned HP/absorbs like a %dmg reduction effect just for my own peace of mind.

To you other warriors, please, I'm begging you, help me get over this dark cloud and enjoy the class again, because at this rate, I'm just not sure and it really sucks.

[Skull_Angel]

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2.0 WAR had always been about Wrath management; the only glimmer of self-healing we had was through Inner Beast, with Bloodbath and Storm's Path being a trickle at best, no more than icing on the cake that is WAR.

[Zegreiart]

2.0 WAR had always been about Wrath management; the only glimmer of self-healing we had was through Inner Beast, with Bloodbath and Storm's Path being a trickle at best, no more than icing on the cake that is WAR.

Kinda feels like you didn't really read much of anything I wrote. I never once mentioned I have issues with managing wrath stacks. It's more of a loss of identity and lack of interest in the direction of things. I wanted to see that trickle become stronger, wanted it to be more. Honestly, I wouldn't even call that icing on the cake, because it isn't. It's not even noticeable in the grand scheme of things. But that's alright, I had a moderately long conversation with a few people. It's not ideal, nor what I want out of things, but I do feel better about the situation. Just a bit disappointed overall, but I'll live.

[Abigs]

pally or bust? yeah i leveled one to 50.. but one thing you're missing

pally is hella boring to play its just halone halone halone halone.. then spirits within / circle of scorn (both off the GCD so just stuff it in there while doing ur halone halone) .. then nothing else.. probably occasional stoneskin or so during transitions

WAR is still very much engaging to play since we have 3 chain combos = buff to piercing / debuff to boss / aggro

-10% from debuff + IB -20% damage redox can yield you -30% for a 6 second duration pallies at -20% (yeah i know its a small window but timing IB right for those big hits is the ONLY thing that matters ie: double wicked wheels / mountain buster/death sentence etc) since passive damage (auto attacks) from bosses are easily healable

the only real differentiation are cooldowns like hallowed ground and lets just hope SE does something about it

Pallies are so boring and way too easy to play

[Vactus]

I loved the mechanics but unless they overpowered (lol get it?) the self heal, we'd still be weaker tanks that require gear vs PLD straight mitigation cooldowns. We tanked stuff that PLD did, but required higher gear standards and that's not good.

Bloodbath, SP and IB would have needed massive buffs to be worthwhile.

However, SE made their choice and I still love my WAR. It's been my main the entire time and I'm not changing that.

[Nalou]

Wrath, as it is today, is barely a playstyle or a mechanic. Would you do BB and SP combos without wrath ? Yes, you would because you need to build aggro and get that 10% DR on the mob.

Wrath as it is now, is only a way to prevent us from spamming IB and SC. We would juste play the same way if IB and SC shared a single 20s coodown. Wrath is a cooldown in disguise, nothing more, nothing less.

Really, in terms of gameplay (mechanics) and freedom to adjust how you deal with stuff (playstyle), wrath as it is now, does little to nothing, because we're not choosing between building or spending wrath, for different benefits.


And yes, War 2.0 was meant to be reactive, because it was centered around using IB to recover from a big blow, and using abilities like Vengeance and Berserk to finish a 5 stack faster in order to recover (which implied some little management). Thrill of Battle aside, warrior had no proactive CD to pop to anticipate incoming blows and ToB is double-edged because it can also be used to recover.

Paladin was more proactive, with a ton of CDs to pop before damage, and a single one to recover: Convalescence.

[Hitokirinomad]

And yes, War 2.0 was meant to be reactive, because it was centered around using IB to recover from a big blow, and using abilities like Vengeance and Berserk to finish a 5 stack faster in order to recover (which implied some little management). Thrill of Battle aside, warrior had no proactive CD to pop to anticipate incoming blows and ToB is double-edged because it can also be used to recover.

Now you've lost me. Foresight, Featherfoot, Vengeance, Berserk are all (even in 2.0) proactive skills. You weren't using them to counter something the enemy HAD done, you used it ahead of time. I already said ToB could be proactive or reactive. Inner Beast is one skill that's not even Warrior exclusive(big hit + self heal? hrm...Life Surge). The only thing exclusive to Warrior is Wrath.

I'm not even sure why you continue to say if IB and SC were cooldowns nothing would change, because right now, IB and SC aren't on 20 sec cooldowns. It's an either/or situation, with Unchained in the mix. How would NOT having to make that choice of what to spend stacks on not fundamentally change the nature of the class? Because you still use Butcher'S Block?

[Nalou]

Foresight, Featherfoot, Vengeance, Berserk are all (even in 2.0) proactive skills.

Yes, but defensively speaking they are (were) really weak. You don't pop Foresight to mitigate a table flip or a Spaceship crash.

How is managing Wrath not WAR's playstyle?

Well if you call this "managing" then it's probably better if we quit this discussion because we'll never agree.

[Skull_Angel]

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I'm not sure what you're motioning at with your reply to Hitokirinomad; (unless you were geared out in 2.0) Inner Beast was a very weak ability as well, it required you to use Berserk and/or RNG (critical) to be a decent reactive self-heal. Yes, WAR's native abilities were (and Foresight and Bloodbath arguably still are) weak as well, but they were still part of the tool set.

Without properly "managing" your Wrath you could(2.0)/can(2.1) not properly utilize the strong abilities attached to it. Full Wrath isn't magically there when you need it, the enemy doesn't give it to you before it decides to use it's tank wrecking ability, you need to make sure it is available when it's needed; this has always been the core of WAR in ARR.

[Skull_Angel]

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How is managing Wrath not WAR's playstyle? "How do I want to build Warth?: How immediately do I need a full stack? Can I casually build it? Go through your combos. Do I need it very soon? Am I at more than 3 stacks with a Wrath combo ability pre-loaded and/or Berserk ready (or will I not need Vengeance soon?)? Use preloaded combo ability and/or pop Berserk (or Vengeance). Am I at less then 3 stacks and need to use IB/SS now? Pop Infuriate. Am I at full Wrath and don't need to use it now, but soon? Sit on it unless you Infuriate is ready and you won't need it in the foreseeable future."

WAR only had one really reactive ability (arguably 2 if ToB was beneficial to use after the fact) in 2.0 and it relied on wrath management; it was also pretty weak w/o buffs and relied heavily on gear. WAR also had/has 2 proactive abilities (Foresight and Bloodbath) and 3 Wrath management abilities (Infuriate, Vengeance and Berserk).