New Class/Job in 2.2?

[DarkStar]

I said a Ji was a (Halberd). >_>



In this picture you can see the early stages of the Ji and it's Scythe-like structures, combining the thrust of the spear and the hook of the scythe as a counter to dodging.

I will admit, it's probably just because I'm not an expert on early asian weaponry (Heck, I'm not an expert on any form of weaponry!), but I'm having a hard time spotting any similarities between the Ji and the Scythe. Would you be so kind as to point them out?

[peaches]

I'd love to think so, but I really doubt they'd add a new class or job outside of an expansion

[XanderOlivieri]

I'd love to think so, but I really doubt they'd add a new class or job outside of an expansion

I think it was said they they'd rather to new Job/Classes outside of expansions. There was a quote somewhere earlier in this thread or in another of the New Job threads.

[OmegaNovaios]

I will admit, it's probably just because I'm not an expert on early asian weaponry (Heck, I'm not an expert on any form of weaponry!), but I'm having a hard time spotting any similarities between the Ji and the Scythe. Would you be so kind as to point them out?

Guess I'll "crop" it for you.



This is what a "Ge" (dagger-axe) looks like. There are many variances of the Ge including but not limited to the pic above. One of 2 wpns, the other being Qiang (spear), predating the creation of the Ji. The blade resembles a Scythe far more than a Dagger and a Dagger far more than an Axe. The pole-arm resembles a Scythe and Axe equally and both far more than a dagger.

[Nahara]

I think it was said they they'd rather to new Job/Classes outside of expansions. There was a quote somewhere earlier in this thread or in another of the New Job threads.

I believe the reasoning was that Legacy players were most likely to have everything maxed out at the start, so SE wanted to introduce stuff without making them wait for whole new expansions.

I really like this approach, as the developers can release things when they're ready and let people enjoy them right away, rather than being forced to sit on them until some major expansion gets released.

[Kitru]

Guess I'll "crop" it for you.

And you would only think that is a scythe blade if you had no clue what you were talking about. A scythe blade would be exceptionally long (.5m or thereabouts) and that's, at most, 10cm (not to mention that the tip is actually sharpened and the blade straight so that it can actually be used for piercing). It's more properly considered a sharpened hook or spike (which, as I said before, were traditional aspects of halberds that had absolutely nothing to do with scythes). In fact, the protrusive edge you're emphasizing wasn't actually called a scythe (it was called a dagger-axe) and was used as a secondary aspect of a thrusting spear (you would try to catch an opponent with it while pulling your spear back from a missed thrust; use of it as a primary weapon would be a terrible idea, given how comparatively easy it is to avoid if you know that's what your target is planning on doing).

The hooks/spikes/blades that protruded from the side of a halberd (and even the dagger-axe itself) were heavily restricted in their usefulness (really only there for dismounting riders and dislodging shields), which was perfectly acceptable because the halberd was the medieval warfare equivalent of the multiplex knife: a bunch of specific functions folded together into a single package. A halberd had a spear head for thrusting, a hook/spike for dismounting/piercing, and an axe head/edge for cleaving (sometimes the hook/spike and the axe head were combined). Going into combat with a weapon only using the hook/spike (using only one of the other heads would just be using a spear or axe, respectively) would be marginally better than just going in with a quarterstaff.

[OmegaNovaios]

I think it was said they they'd rather to new Job/Classes outside of expansions. There was a quote somewhere earlier in this thread or in another of the New Job threads.

IMO jobs should be released for existing classes every major patch and classes with one corresponding job should be released with every expansion. I would much rather see jobs added alongside content at at 50%/50% ratio compared to content at a 100% ratio when people just clear content and are done with said content after they obtain all desired loot/don't play play said content due to loot lockout.

Aside from that, SE pretty much wastes resources in the long term by making content obsolete in that gear is "ideally" replaced every 3 months. Jobs will never be replaced, it will be a choice. Gear won't be because stats scale too linearly due to iLv. There is more of a "progression" in character through replacing gear but it's only temporarily (and if you really look at how SE scaled stats to improve your character then you will see that this form of progression is very minimal, almost a placebo).

A better form of progression is to allow players to obtain things that will never be PERMANENTLY replaced (which I consider a long term waste of resources) but instead offers the player a choice. Merits that act like secondary job traits (like FFXI). Actions that can be gained post Lv cap with a limit/oppotunity cost on number of total actions that can be equipped (like Guild Wars, the first). Unlocking and leveling new jobs to play on/use for Cross-Class Actions (FFXI/FFXIV). Or SE can do something completely unique, but otherwise JUST having gear (that becomes completely obsolete in the future) as a progression is bland.

[OmegaNovaios]

And you would only think that is a scythe blade if you had no clue what you were talking about. A scythe blade would be exceptionally long (.5m or thereabouts) and that's, at most, 10cm (not to mention that the tip is actually sharpened and the blade straight so that it can actually be used for piercing). It's more properly considered a sharpened hook or spike (which, as I said before, were traditional aspects of halberds that had absolutely nothing to do with scythes). In fact, the protrusive edge you're emphasizing wasn't actually called a scythe (it was called a dagger-axe) and was used as a secondary aspect of a thrusting spear (you would try to catch an opponent with it while pulling your spear back from a missed thrust; use of it as a primary weapon would be a terrible idea, given how comparatively easy it is to avoid if you know that's what your target is planning on doing).

Before the Ji was created the Ge was used in real Chinese combat. It was not possible to follow up with a hook attack after a missed thrust because it did not have a spear tip to thrust with. The hook/side stab were its PRIMARY forms of attack.

In a virtual world all real world practicality is irrelevant. There is no concern of weapon production costs (developers set what is required to create one), usefulness is determined by a ratio of damage and utility of the job (computer code is completely indifferent to which object meshes and animations are being used), and the players are only limited to play style and what they enjoy doing. Incorporating a Scythe (or any wpn) isn't difficult. Comparing the animations of any weapon in an MMO would be appear ridiculous to how that weapon is/would be used in the real world (IE harp on a bow).

A Scythe doesn't have to be 100% traditional in appearance either. It can very easily be made into a far more "practical" wpn w/o changing the identity beyond recognition.

[Georgevonfranken]

You people arguing real world weapons while I run around on a horsebird beating monsters up with a book.

[Rivest]

Let me post something that is actually on topic, instead of discussing if a Scythe is a weapon or a farming tool.

Musketeer would make sense since it would create a second ranged physical DPS.
Of all the other type of roles there are two classes, except for the ranged physical DPS.

Tank:
Warrior
Paladin

Healer:
White mage
Scholar

Melee DPS:
Dragoon
Monk

Caster:
Black Mage
Summoner

Ranged Physical:
Bard
-

It would only be natural to have another ranged physical class/job in the game.