What's The Point of Pacification After Berserk

[Dhex]

IIRC it can be esuna'd.

My Berserk has a macro component that notifies at the end of the buff duration "Beware - Pacification 5s" if a WHM acts on it - great and if not oh well.

[Derza]

@Traek
Correct me if i'm wrong... but can't you still use brutal swing, provoke AND flash while pacification is on(aswell as all other off cooldown skills)? Making those situations not a problem at all for a tank...

[NeonC]

Can someone post that Macro to alert your healer of when to esuna the pacification? SPecifically this one I saw that seemed to have an update on when it was going to end...like "berserk ending in 10 sec...berserk ending in.." etc

[Myrhn]

I rather have pacification than a defence reduction like FFXI or like the more traditional FF that your character auto attack mindlessly.

[Zoomie]

Its cute that you are whiteknighting though. Keep on trucking. Obviously there are no flaws in SE game design, let us all bow down before their greatness! Amirite? /eyeroll

As I stated before... plan out when to use it. If you're pulling something BRAND new then don't use berserk. I'm not saying I enjoy being pacified but that its completely manageable and you're blowing its effect way out of proportion.

If you're on new content there is a lot to be learned to include when its OK to be pacified.

[Seidaku]

Berserk could deal dmg to the tank instead lol. Mindless rage to me signifies hurting yourself along with your opponent. :P

[Traek]

@Traek
Correct me if i'm wrong... but can't you still use brutal swing, provoke AND flash while pacification is on(aswell as all other off cooldown skills)? Making those situations not a problem at all for a tank...

You can use them all yes. They aren't all in one, and have benefits or detrimental effects if used incorrectly however. Flash is only really usable 3 times in combat for Warrior. Brutal swing is ST, not much threat gen, and 30 second CD (will be 20 in 2.1). Provoke if used can be wasted with no follow up. If something is out of range (heal pulls threat, or DD doesn't stop AoE) it'll quickly run out of range of flash, completely wasting provoke (where we'd normally Tomahawk after).

People seem to be mistaken that I'm prophesying the end of Warrior tanking because of Pacification. I'm really not. We obviously work around it now because we have to. It is still bad by design for a tank on multiple levels, and again leads to the skill being saved or unused, further reducing its effectiveness. This can easily be seen if you play a PLD, and blow it without second thoughts or detrimental effect. Worst case scenario you lose a little time of extra threat gen you didn't need to begin with.

As I stated before... plan out when to use it. If you're pulling something BRAND new then don't use berserk. I'm not saying I enjoy being pacified but that its completely manageable and you're blowing its effect way out of proportion.

If you're on new content there is a lot to be learned to include when its OK to be pacified.

You are proving my point that progression and new content tanking makes the skill as a tank bad, yes. God forbid SE doesn't add a scripted fight, and throws something random at people. The fact people are trying to come up with work arounds (cross class skills lulz) and excuses (learn all aspects of every fight to heart before yo use it!) just shows its not good design for a tank to be pacified.

[Zoomie]

SNIP

I think this comes down to is that you don't like/want the pacify and others don't think is a big deal. Its far from bad design, it forces us to make a decision between a big dmg/threat gen ability and the potential untimely pacify.

[Traek]

I think this comes down to is that you don't like/want the pacify and others don't think is a big deal. Its far from bad design, it forces us to make a decision between a big dmg/threat gen ability and the potential untimely pacify.

No, I am arguing pacification on tanks is bad game design, which no one has refuted. You and a few others are arguing it is "manageable" (which isn't true in instances of progression/random occurrences). Its like defending 2.0 Warrior and saying 2.1 isn't necessary. Please tell me where PLD needs to make this similar choice in their dmg/threat gen ability. Also, what Warrior abilities are *necessary* for PLD to take in order to use all their abilities effectively?

[SpookyGhost]

No, I am arguing pacification on tanks is bad game design, which no one has refuted. You and a few others are arguing it is "manageable" (which isn't true in instances of progression/random occurrences). Its like defending 2.0 Warrior and saying 2.1 isn't necessary. Please tell me where PLD needs to make this similar choice in their dmg/threat gen ability. Also, what Warrior abilities are *necessary* for PLD to take in order to use all their abilities effectively?

Hi. Move is called Berserk. Not every move needs to be designed solely around how your class/job functions. You go nuts for 20 seconds, need to calm down for 5. The pacification has never, ever, at any point been an issue for me. You can still use Brutual Swing + Flash AT THE SAME TIME, then another Flash. Then you're no longer pacified. If you started a combo before pacification, you can still continue the combo at the end of that rotation. You also have access to Vengeance OR Featherfoot, both of which are amazing for this situation (you can also gain a stack of Wrath with Vengeance while pacified, but also you should obviously never couple Vengeance + FF).

Paladin has FoF, which is great and all, but does PLD have Unchained? Do they have Internal Release? Can they couple all 3 and become miles ahead in threat? No, they can't. The trade off is that you get all this damage/enmity potential and have to relax for all of 5 seconds which you can STILL DO SOME MOVES IN.

Yes, not having the pacification would be better. Sure. Wow. Surprise surprise. But there is a REASON that the pacification exists and it isn't gimping you massively as you seem to think it is.

Edit: Also, to answer your first question, they don't because PLD is the easier job of the 2. It might not be a huge difference in difficulty, but it's there. Warriors make decisions, Paladins hit ABC cooldown. You don't need Flash for pacification, it's just a good cross class to have for it. I don't know how that's an argument but... yeah, there ya go.