Catering to the Majority

[Kayanarka]

[QUOTE=Phogg;1432829
Edit 2: Interesting note, while thankfully only encountering a limited number of them, every self proclaimed know it all type I have encountered in Duty Finder, also tends to quit on their parties far more then others. Funny thing is, once they are replaced, everything goes smoothly. Fun note. ^^[/QUOTE]

I had a DPS causing issues and arguing. After he left we went with 3 people and everything was smooth.

[TheRac25]

FFXI -isn't- hard. Now. FFXI -was- hard. Now, it's not.

Either check out some youtube from the old days or get yourself a time machine. After you've armed yourself with some knowledge, try to say that again.

If you have a time machine, let me get in too.

could you please cite something in XI wich you thought was hard? all i seem recall was 5 minute fafs 30 second kirins and 10 minute tias, or maybe you mean getting goldsmithing or clothcraft to 100

[amnie]

I can't even remember the times how often the person who did all the mistakes is also the one ragequitting and insulting. hell, just a few hours ago I had a tank force-DC on us in the lvl 30 hest with the morbol.

well, not to name and shame, but if you ever read this, since I didn't get the chance to tell you this:

YOU NEVER EVER EVER MOVE A BOSS SO THAT THE AOE HITS EVERY SINGLE PARTY MEMBER. IF YOU MOVE TO AVOID AN AOE YOU GET RIGHT BACK TO THE EXACT SAME SPOT YOU WERE IN BEFORE, NOT RUN ALL OVER THE PLACE.

sorry, that was boiling up on me. lol

oh, btw, he managed to have the aoe hit all of us even though we were a whm, a brd and a blm, so all ranged. only way to manage that is doing it on purpose almost. needless to say with the next tank we did it flawlessly. haha

edit1:
on the actual topic

since I mainly play either whm or brd, so I usually have a good view over the entire field, I defintely can say 1-2 things about this game in general

people aren't better or worse than in other games. hell, I played SW:TOR from the start and the community as a whole was much, much worse (granted my view might be a little distorted since I started on Empire side and then on a PVP server. lol. got better when I switched to Republic)
same as in TOR, I expect the community to 'sort itself out' in a few months. by that time we all know whom to party with - and whom to avoid. I myself will stay clear from the elitist jerks, and will go way out of my way actually helping people. heck, part of the reason why I'm not 50 yet is because I keep running the starter dungeons on my whm (my brd is currently my 'main focus') to have some control on the party and make sure 'newbies' have a nice experience. this resorted in me having to tell people they were tanks that thought they were dps (usually marauder but I've met a paladin with that problem, too)
and you know what? I LIKE doing that! I ask if people want to go into a boss fight blindly or if they want to figure it out themselves. I tell people how to turn a boss or how the aggro table works - if I feel there is need for it. if a run is smooth I just chat about every day stuff or tell people that I like their character's look

the more people you teach, the more people you make sure are enjoying themselves, the less likely they turn into jerks at endgame.


edit2:

You're still leveling, and think you're in a position to talk about whats up?

I see posts like this one on this forum all the time, but people have yet to explain to me how exactly end game in ARR is any different than in any other MMO that is somewhat mentionable and came out in the last 2-3 years (let's exclude GW2 here, we all know how their endgame is different and I sure as hell hope nobody considers that something to be 'elitist' about)

in my case that would be TOR and TSW, and in both games I saw all these rants, the EXACT SAME as here, and once I reached 'end game' I had to come to the realisation that people were... well... bonkers. the stuff they complained about was 'too easy' was stuff 90% of the population hadn't even done yet. granted I admit in the case of TOR eternity vault was a joke, but once explosive conflict was released the 'endgame is too easy' argument no longer counted, and it sure as hell is no longer the case with the operations released since. TSW? yeah, sure, it's too easy for some people, but damn.. folks would go mad in that game if they think stuff in ARR is too hard to avoid.

accept it, folks, some people are better at games than others. and usually the people complaining about the lack of difficulty in an MMO are also the same people that are 'done' with a single player game in 1-2 days (or even hours)

[PerrythePlatypus]

Not really the point of my post, but fair enough. That being said, my paladin is level 47. And a handful of classes in the 20s-30s.

You're still leveling, and think you're in a position to talk about whats up?

[busta]

could you please cite something in XI wich you thought was hard? all i seem recall was 5 minute fafs 30 second kirins and 10 minute tias, or maybe you mean getting goldsmithing or clothcraft to 100

When did you play FFXI? Yesterday? It certainly wasn't before 2010. Kirin used to take 36 people nearly 30 minutes minimum with tons of deaths. FFXI was extremely hard before Aht Urhgan. And it was awesome.

[Ryihito]

Maybe you should play a class that requires at least a semblance of skill.

Then come talk.

Take a load of this guy.

Like this game requires skill at all, lol.

[Scratchs]

When did you play FFXI? Yesterday? It certainly wasn't before 2010. Kirin used to take 36 people nearly 30 minutes minimum with tons of deaths. FFXI was extremely hard before Aht Urhgan. And it was awesome.

Seemed to be easier back then for me.. I remember in Kirin fights and those other sky monsters a lot of people would be afk, etc and we still won. Also Dynamis tons of afkers and you could still win. Only thing harder was the extreme time it took to travel. This game it seems harder and less forgiving every player needs to be doing their job or you just don't win.

[busta]

Seemed to be easier back then for me.. I remember in Kirin fights and those other sky monsters a lot of people would be afk, etc and we still won. Also Dynamis tons of afkers and you could still win. Only thing harder was the extreme time it took to travel. This game it seems harder and less forgiving every player needs to be doing their job or you just don't win.

I had the literal opposite experience and so did virtually everyone else. That why you hear echoes of horror about the infamous Valkurm Dunes. You had to work hard just to get past lv10. If even one key player messed up in a giant alliance in FFXI, everyone wiped. It took tons of hard work and dedication to get anywhere in that game. CoP took me nearly a year to beat. Even the very first CoP missions sometimes took me more than 10 tries and prepping for those were super expensive and time consuming. Hard work was rewarding and satisfying. Failure was punished. Everything was extremely intricate and complex enough to make it feel like a real living world but it worked behind the scenes enough so new players weren't too intimidated.

I can count the times I've died in this game on one hand. I ran out of fingers and toes to count with on my first day of deaths in FFXI. It was brutal. I raged hard but I kept at it. Then I took up the most brutal job of all: Beastmaster. And this was back in the day when you had to leave your pet to get full exp. 20 deaths a day for a Beastmaster was common. And the exp loss from that sometimes lead to negative total exp gains for hours of hard work. But you gained more skill. You learned your environment. You timed everything perfectly. It was like improving at Chess or Go. It was exciting and every time you leveled up it felt really good.

[Sixmp]

I had the literal opposite experience and so did virtually everyone else. That why you hear echoes of horror about the infamous Valkurm Dunes. You had to work hard just to get past lv10. If even one key player messed up in a giant alliance in FFXI, everyone wiped. It took tons of hard work and dedication to get anywhere in that game. CoP took me nearly a year to beat. Even the very first CoP missions sometimes took me more than 10 tries and prepping for those were super expensive and time consuming. Hard work was rewarding and satisfying. Failure was punished. Everything was extremely intricate and complex enough to make it feel like a real living world but it worked behind the scenes enough so new players weren't too intimidated.

I can count the times I've died in this game on one hand. I ran out of fingers and toes to count with on my first day of deaths in FFXI. It was brutal. I raged hard but I kept at it. Then I took up the most brutal job of all: Beastmaster. And this was back in the day when you had to leave your pet to get full exp. 20 deaths a day for a Beastmaster was common. And the exp loss from that sometimes lead to negative total exp gains for hours of hard work. But you gained more skill. You learned your environment. You timed everything perfectly. It was like improving at Chess or Go. It was exciting and every time you leveled up it felt really good.

I heard they are bringing BST to FFXIV ARR and i am hoping that it will be a solo job that is capable to soloing all the content, even the stuff for 4 man parties. Then for higher parties they need to team up with other BST or join a normal party.

I miss my BST from FFXI. I miss the difficulty of leveling. That moment where you fail a charm in the middle of a fight and you now have 2 mobs swatting at you. You manage to charm one as a pet and get it to attack the other and getting away with a slither of HP left. Curing yourself at a distance so not to take hate. I remember holding my breath through those moments

[Yurikitty]

What message are we sending when we just dumb down anything that is to hard? Years ago we started to dumb things down for kids in schools to push up test scores to make ourselves (merica) look good to the world. My kids no longer are taught social studies, cursive writing, American history (for all its worth) or science. Should this keep up? NO! Is it doing us any good? Hell no. So should the game keep catering to the insta win people? Those that think spending a week on a raid is to hard, spending 4 months to gear up takes to much time, no! It sickens me how lazy the world has become. Please do not push this agenda any more. You dont have to be hard core to make progress. Dumbing down the game only adds to the problems, it wont fix them. Ever.