Anti-Speed Run Mechanism

[Sakasa]

Def not the case. If you go through the dungeon and don't die besides sac the repairs are much cheaper than clearing fully. Trash is just useless. Give me vendor trash and chance at items and I'll kill them. But costing me more money, being slower and giving me nothing annoys me. I did it once fully to experience it and now I'm doing it to progress my character.

Yeah but you see here is the thing while that is perfectly alright you are now going to force people to do it your way now or fully experience it again with new people

[bwalker36]

Yeah but you see here is the thing while that is perfectly alright you are now going to force people to do it your way now or fully experience it again with new people

Me no. I will try to find full parties. If I cannot I simple ask the group what they want to do. If they have all been there and want to we speed run. If two payers are new, I'm not speed running to die on bosses well go through it slowly and learn them some AK.

But a lot of people do tend to be that way or will quit if they don't get the speedrun. I prefer the speedrun but will not rage quit especially after waiting 15 mintues for the server queue anyway.

[Riku_Toiiku]

I wouldn't mind speedruns, but... from recent experience, doing a dungeon for the first time having not spedrun in 2.0 before, whilst not having it explained to me nor being told it's a speedrun, then being raged at and insulted in my face for not being able to read minds...

I've never quit a party before. But I couldn't stay there with those jerks as they treat me like a piece of crap. I hope I ruined their speedrun by quitting, because it's more than they deserve. Speedrun needs to have a seperate tick box.

[Veurr]

A new player is going to be treated badly by veteran players in a group finder regardless of what sort of run is happening. But my biggest issues with new players in dungeons are A. They aren't up front about it and B. They don't listen. If someone takes the time to lay out a strategy for you. Just listen ask questions by all means but don't stand there and argue for 15 minutes.

Also before you call for nerfs to speed runs let me lay a little math on you. In order to achieve a full set of darklight gear not counting accessories, you need about 3650 tomes. So 45 runs of AK or 36 of Castrum/Praetorium. The average speed run takes 20 minutes. So even going as fast you can you will have to run AK for around 14 hours to complete yout darklight set. You will then have to continue to run it around 8 times a week to cap myth tomes. With full party dungeon queues capping out around 20 minutes do you really want systems put in place that would triple the amount of time runs take?

[Riku_Toiiku]

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With me, it wasn't even a case of my own error. Literally, I got asked if I was new, I said yes, party ran off without saying anything, didn't tell me one bit of strategy, and raged at me for getting it wrong. Oh you wanted me to die there to lose aggro? Then tell me? Rather than shout at me for staying alive? Oh, now you're angry I returned whilst half the party is dead? Could have told me that it was part of the strategy to pull mobs, die to lose agro then res. I had no clue at all what was going on by that point. And then the party lost to the boss and I was shouted at for not returning straight away, despite being told off the last time. To me, that was contradictory commands, all told in hindsight, and I got completely slated and spoken about between party members right in front of me just because I couldn't read their minds. This is not the mentality I want to ever face again.

[Subucnimorning]

This is not the mentality I want to ever face again.

This is a player mentality problem not a speed run problem. I do speed runs constantly in AK and don't run into this kind of thing. Taking away speed runs is not going to fix the issue you faced.

[Riku_Toiiku]

This is a player mentality problem not a speed run problem. I do speed runs constantly in AK and don't run into this kind of thing. Taking away speed runs is not going to fix the issue you faced.

I personally never sugested any such thing.

Just a seperate tick box or something for speed runs to put like-minded individuals together.

Speed runners get their speed runs, new players get more patient (hopefully) parties. Everyone's happy.

[pandabearcat]

Someone's already mentioned the solution before, and the solution is to make trash worthwhile.. We don't need more discussion. Once they do that, sure, stop speedrunning. But for now, if you do this, amdapor will be EVEN MORE CROWDED as runs take longer, and become a massive 2 hour long grind train and monsters still give absolutely nothing.

If you made every mob in amdapor drop 1 tomestone, bam. Instantly, I will clear the entire zone. Maybe 10% chance of a myth tomestone too.

And for those who want to stop this "exploit", you're only hurting yourself. Your queues will be longer, people won't run as much, and the people that you want to punish already have full darklight, and full 60 greens for all their toons, while you struggle to find the almost 15 (yes 15 hours, if we say 1.5-2 hours for a full run of amdapor) to cap out on myths every week.

[LilSmalls]

A few further issues raised now:
1. Player behaviour.
2. Trash Mobs vs "Normal Play"

Firstly, Player Behaviour. I've had great random parties, lastnight was my first experience with horror, trying to complete Castrum first time. I'd watched a vid of the run, told the party it was my first run. There was no communication, no marking targets and no strategy talked about. We beat it after a few deaths but it was hands down the worst experience to date. I'm actively looking for a FC on Sargatanas now so I can go with a few familiar faces.

Trash Mobs vs "Normal Play" - I think this highlights the core reasons people want to play games. For some unless there is a measurable reward then it is not fun, for others (i'm in this camp) the process of playing is the fun.

I ran a 2nd dungeon after Castrum. For all 4 of us it was our first, all communicated and it was an absolute blast! Only wiped once when figuring out what the big Tonberry was doing.

[Kiteless]

Someone's already mentioned the solution before, and the solution is to make trash worthwhile.. We don't need more discussion. Once they do that, sure, stop speedrunning. But for now, if you do this, amdapor will be EVEN MORE CROWDED as runs take longer, and become a massive 2 hour long grind train and monsters still give absolutely nothing.

If you made every mob in amdapor drop 1 tomestone, bam. Instantly, I will clear the entire zone. Maybe 10% chance of a myth tomestone too.

I cannot upvote this enough. I haven't quite gotten to that specific point in the game yet, but I do dread it. The worst part is that such a simple fix as this one listed above would be enough to make most parties happy.