What do you think of the point allotment system?

[Physic]

Uhhh, there is an advantage in having a more balanced charachter, and cross class skills do come into this. Just because some people dont like those playstyles doesnt make them worthless. Really it is a case of people wanting to be the best at everything.
Kilta is actually right, the plan was, your physical level /stat allocation decides who your charachter really is, your discipline is what your doing. The reason they have caps on how much stats effect you per ranks is so that you have reason to distribute your stats around, its also why there is diminishing returns at high levels of one stat. And yeah, cross class skills are less effective than main class skills, but the +10 ability skill is a very noticeable boost, chakra goes up very noticeably, and recast drops a lot, and honestly before, this was probably supposed to be only the first increase in subjob effectiveness.
There are certain things you just cant avoid, like lack of mattack on a weapon, but they could have added certain weapons that have midranged mattack for these playstyles.

My guess is a mostly balanced person making use of the trait switching systems, can get a fairly good performance on multiple jobs, The whole idea is that you can specialize, and you will see some improvement, but it wont be a direct correlation, the truth is they would have expected people to be way more balanced than most chose to be.


Also the system allows you to change your stats, if you made a mistake, or if you decide long term you want to be a different ttype of charachter, but its not made to make you go from being the best archer to the best conjurer to the best pugilist. The system is only really bad for min maxers, who want to be able to do everything. Its also why they are mad that thier stats have diminishing returns and soft caps.

I agree though it would be better if every stat had more effectiveness for all jobs, more use for some int on pug, or some str on con

[BruceyBruceyBangBang]

Uhhh, there is an advantage in having a more balanced charachter, and cross class skills do come into this. Just because some people dont like those playstyles doesnt make them worthless. Really it is a case of people wanting to be the best at everything.
Kilta is actually right, the plan was, your physical level /stat allocation decides who your charachter really is, your discipline is what your doing. The reason they have caps on how much stats effect you per ranks is so that you have reason to distribute your stats around, its also why there is diminishing returns at high levels of one stat. And yeah, cross class skills are less effective than main class skills, but the +10 ability skill is a very noticeable boost, chakra goes up very noticeably, and recast drops a lot, and honestly before, this was probably supposed to be only the first increase in subjob effectiveness.
There are certain things you just cant avoid, like lack of mattack on a weapon, but they could have added certain weapons that have midranged mattack for these playstyles.

My guess is a mostly balanced person making use of the trait switching systems, can get a fairly good performance on multiple jobs, The whole idea is that you can specialize, and you will see some improvement, but it wont be a direct correlation, the truth is they would have expected people to be way more balanced than most chose to be.


Also the system allows you to change your stats, if you made a mistake, or if you decide long term you want to be a different ttype of charachter, but its not made to make you go from being the best archer to the best conjurer to the best pugilist. The system is only really bad for min maxers, who want to be able to do everything. Its also why they are mad that thier stats have diminishing returns and soft caps.

I agree though it would be better if every stat had more effectiveness for all jobs, more use for some int on pug, or some str on con

If this were true, which it could very well be, then it's more of a reason to redesign it. There is no reason to have the same performance, but different skills for whatever class you are playing as.

It should be more open. It starts to get boring when everyone is only marginally different performance wise.

[Physic]

If this were true, which it could very well be, then it's more of a reason to redesign it. There is no reason to have the same performance, but different skills for whatever class you are playing as.

It should be more open. It starts to get boring when everyone is only marginally different performance wise.

So you want people to be more gimp? even though they are the same class? With similar gear? this has very rarely been the case in MMo history

basically setting your attributes was supposed to be like making your own race, not making you totally gimp or totally overpowered. And honestly it makes sense in that respect.

[Jinko]

basically setting your attributes was supposed to be like making your own race, not making you totally gimp or totally overpowered. And honestly it makes sense in that respect.

Huh where did you get this from ?

[Physic]

Huh where did you get this from ?

Thats what the system as it is creates, keep in mind initially they werent going to let people change thier stats at all. Also look at the point re allotment system, the cool down and specific amount of points taken from each value, It is not designed so you can respec instantly into any class, It is designed completely opposite. They did though see the value of someone who wants to change thier bias, without creating an all new charachter, so you can do that, but over time.

maybe my word race is misleading, it is supposed to be like how race is in other games, You make a charachter that excels at certain things more than others. The difference is there is no predefined sets, and you can determine what you excel in. For example, while there is usually a heavy HP heavy strength race, there is not usually a heavy HP heavy INT race, you can in this game build this type bias for your charachter, and play the game with those advantages.
You are still filtered by class choice but for that class you are that.

and Alexia, i wouldnt be so sure about your theory, because initially they had said they were going to try to make a game withouth levels at all, and there was an outcry. I think physical level was always meant to be the background stat, lets be honest, a level 50 physical guy with only 2 skills, isnt going to be able to fight high level things, and how would you handle his skill point gain? he shouldnt be killing level 1 mobs like his rank level, and he would be killed killing things level 50 like his physical level. I could be wrong though, you might be right, i just dont see how they would have executed that.

[AlexiaKidd]

Thats what the system as it is creates, keep in mind initially they werent going to let people change thier stats at all. Also look at the point re allotment system, the cool down and specific amount of points taken from each value, It is not designed so you can respec instantly into any class, It is designed completely opposite. They did though see the value of someone who wants to change thier bias, without creating an all new charachter, so you can do that, but over time.

maybe my word race is misleading, it is supposed to be like how race is in other games, You make a charachter that excels at certain things more than others. The difference is there is no predefined sets, and you can determine what you excel in. For example, while there is usually a heavy HP heavy strength race, there is not usually a heavy HP heavy INT race, you can in this game build this type bias for your charachter, and play the game with those advantages.
You are still filtered by class choice but for that class you are that.

and Alexia, i wouldnt be so sure about your theory, because initially they had said they were going to try to make a game withouth levels at all, and there was an outcry. I think physical level was always meant to be the background stat, lets be honest, a level 50 physical guy with only 2 skills, isnt going to be able to fight high level things, and how would you handle his skill point gain? he shouldnt be killing level 1 mobs like his rank level, and he would be killed killing things level 50 like his physical level. I could be wrong though, you might be right, i just dont see how they would have executed that.

The skill point gain would have been handled exactly like it was in FFXI with Weapon Skillup's and that is exactly how it worked at launch. As for not having levels that was still sort of true you had level's but only up to whatever the cap was so in our case now R50, once you hit R50 Physical Level that is it, all you have left is to level your weapons to shape your class. That is probably why you changed it as I think that would have gotten pretty boring fast.

Also lets not forget that you wouldn't be able to get to Physical Level 50 without gaining any skills as don't forget even DoL/DoH were supposed to have fighting skills originally.

[Rentahamster]

Also lets not forget that you wouldn't be able to get to Physical Level 50 without gaining any skills as don't forget even DoL/DoH were supposed to have fighting skills originally.

Perhaps that was part of the issue. Maybe they either couldn't get the motion capture for the crafter combat done in time and/or could get the crafters integrated into combat soon enough, so they just said screw it and went with the quasi-shoehorned system we got now.

[Kilta_Firelotus]

If this were true, which it could very well be, then it's more of a reason to redesign it. There is no reason to have the same performance, but different skills for whatever class you are playing as.

It should be more open. It starts to get boring when everyone is only marginally different performance wise.

What is truely boring is cookie cutting. AkA what min/maxers want. It was dull in ffxi that EVERY ninja was expected to tank, it was boring that EVERY rdm had to back line heal. What isn't boring is seeing people with different set ups. Like parting with a glad and seeing them use ice attacks and tanking skills, then in a new party a different glad using cures and buffs while dding. Like in the .hack animes. You see people of similar classes but play them completely differently. I would like to see more people play their classes with different styles.
I'm setting my character up to be a fire user. And for my clases will mostly use fire base abilities/ spells.

[Ava]

I don't mind the idea behind it, but I hate its current implementation. I think it should be either greatly expanded or completely removed. Stats need to mean something, but when that happens they will fall victim to cookie cutter specs (rendering the whole system pointless) or people getting locked into situational specs, which really sucks for a game that encourages leveling multiple classes.

I suggested in another thread doing something like a paradigm shift system from FFXIII, where you can make like 3 sets of stats and swap between them in in combat. But I also feel in addition, players should have those 3 sets for each class they level, or at least 3 sets for each set of classes like a set of 3 for DoM and a set of 3 for DoW. Or heck, maybe make these "sets" an alternate progression system involving quests every 10 physical levels or so for a total of 5.

The current implementation is awful, though. And respeccing is pointless when they refund such a small amount of points.