Please keep: Surplus, repairs, stat point allocation and job flexibility!

[Abriael]

Really? Many people proposed a rested system back then, on various forums and places on the internet.

Many people had seen it in action by then, and the developers, er, seem to have listened, seeing as how fatigue is on the docket of things to be looked into.

I proposed the rested system or a mitigation of the system since the very beginning of the beta 2 phase. But I'm also aware that telling a developer "just scrap it" simply doesn't work.
If you want to get something from developers you need to mediate.

Also, the experience curve gets slapped around quite often during a release and in the following weeks. You cannot judge a system that influences it until it stabilizes.

As I said, the system isn't "Bad" per se, but it can be done better, and now that the team has changed, there's a serious possibility that the new director will consider just replacing it with something equally functional but less convoluted.

[ShinChuck]

I proposed the rested system or a mitigation of the system since the very beginning of the beta 2 phase. But I'm also aware that telling a developer "just scrap it" simply doesn't work.
If you want to get something from developers you need to mediate.

Also, the experience curve gets slapped around quite often during a release and in the following weeks. You cannot judge a system that influences it until it stabilizes.

As I said, the system isn't "Bad" per se, but it can be done better, and now that the team has changed, there's a serious possibility that the new director will consider just replacing it with something equally functional but less convoluted.

But the idea had been around long before the XIV beta, and was almost assuredly bandied about prior to Beta 2. I've asked for search functions, MP regen, and better targetting since the beta. That doesn't mean I originated those ideas, nor will I actually try to say out of every single person ever discussing FFXIV I was the first to bring them up.

You also never mentioned that you'd prefer a resting-based EXP system back when we were debating the Fatigue system, so forgive me if it sounds a little convenient now that, with SE leaning that way, you say, "But I really supported the idea from the beginning!"

We had enough experience at the time to judge the system. And the complaints ended up being correct, which also supports the idea that we had judged correctly and in an appropriate time frame. So correct, in fact, that SE has acknowledged this. It again sounds convenient that you say you supported a different system, but also say that you felt the fatigue system in place could be fine (a judgment in itself).

If we didn't have enough time to judge it, why would you argue for a different system? You'd have no grounds to.

Even all that being said, I do agree with the last part, I think the new team will likely make some notable changes to it.

[Abriael]

But the idea had been around long before the XIV beta, and was almost assuredly bandied about prior to Beta 2

Beta 2 is when people actually NOTICED the system. Before beta 2 Fatigue was an unknown concept.

You also never mentioned that you'd prefer a resting-based EXP system back when we were debating the Fatigue system, so forgive me if it sounds a little convenient now that, with SE leaning that way, you say, "But I really supported the idea from the beginning!"

Beta forums were public. My nickname never changed. But you're very free not to believe it. I don't really care.
The fact that I didn't mention it with you over twitter, doesn't mean I didn't mention it anywhere. You aren't really the center of my world, and Twitter isn't the center of my online activities.

We had enough experience at the time to judge the system.

Nope. Until the experience curve is stable you can't judge how much the system will change it.

And the complaints ended up being correct

Quite the opposite. The complaints ended up being wildly exaggerated and overboard. Surplus was painted as a gamekiller, forcing people not to play more than a few hours a week and all that, and then lined with urban legends and trolling and hate agendas.

On the other hand reality demonstrated that surplus killed nothing, that's nearly ininfluential on 99% of the players' experience of the game and that people just went up in arms over nearly nothing.

Surprlus isn't the devil as you and others painted it. It has never been, and it will never be. This doesn't mean that there's no better alternative possible.

If we didn't have enough time to judge it, why would you argue for a different system? You'd have no grounds to.

You know, people speculate during betas, and offer suggestions/feedback, even when information is limited. I tend to as well.

[ShinChuck]

Beta 2 is when people actually NOTICED the system. Before beta 2 Fatigue was an unknown concept.
Beta forums were public. My nickname never changed. But you're very free not to believe it. I don't really care.
The fact that I didn't mention it with you over twitter, doesn't mean I didn't mention it anywhere. You aren't really the center of my world, and Twitter isn't the center of my online activities.

WoW has had a rewards-based system for a long time, as have many others. Forgive me for not believing you originated discussion of a fairly commonplace MMO aspect in regards to XIV. EXP issues had certainly been discussed by many - developers, fans - long before "fatigue" showed up in force.

But for not caring, you're certainly taking the time to try and sound convincing!

Nope. Until the experience curve is stable you can't judge how much the system will change it.


Quite the opposite. The complaints ended up being wildly exaggerated and overboard. Surplus was painted as a gamekiller, forcing people not to play more than a few hours a week and all that, and then lined with urban legends and trolling and hate agendas.

On the other hand reality demonstrated that surplus killed nothing, that's nearly ininfluential on 99% of the players' experience of the game and that people just went up in arms over nearly nothing.

Surprlus isn't the devil as you and others painted it. It has never been, and it will never be. This doesn't mean that there's no better alternative possible.

We judged, and judged properly, by your own admission. People went up in arms - and SE agrees with them, it appears. So whether or not *you* deem it was over nothing, much of the fanbase, and SE themselves, seem to agree it was something an issue.

And myself and many others had asked for one of the better (your word!) alternatives. I even said as much it wasn't the "devil" but it was the principle and the alternatives available. So you concede to defending a system knowing there's better out there. Fair enough, I'll gladly accept that concession to our debate months ago, and give you props for being forthright about it!