A Little Pain with my Pleasure

[Arkine]

People need to fear death, in 1.0 death was nothing important, while in XI it was a real threat and people avoided it, and that was thrilling.

I'm in favor of a harsher death penalty, doesn't need to be exp loss, but harsh enough to make people think twice before doing something stupid.

[Zehira]

People need to fear death, in 1.0 death was nothing important, while in XI it was a real threat and people avoided it, and that was thrilling.

I'm in favor of a harsher death penalty, doesn't need to be exp loss, but harsh enough to make people think twice before doing something stupid.

I am not fear death even though it would cause them crying and whining wanna blame WHM for not healing enough.

My only fear in XI was when in CoP if we fail in any battle then whether party members want to give up for the day or try again.

[fusional]

while in XI it was a real threat and people avoided it.

yeah, they avoided it by not killing kirin until 3 years after a safe strategy had already been completely hammered into the ground by focused endgame LSs.

and let's not forget all the crying and moaning about how 'difficult' CoP missions were. so, good players who didn't fear death pushed through CoP before any nerfs just fine, and everyone else moaned until it was pretty much categorically nerfed.

time and time again- the kind of people who are dissuaded by XP death penalties, the kind of people who we'd HOPE would play better as a result of XP death penalties... it only works in theory. in practice they either just wait until content is trivialized or until devs nerf it for them. this does nothing to solve the problem of poor play.

so, yeah. sounds awesome! let's have more of that!

nostalgia goggles are a hell of a drug.

[Lirion]

I rather have gear break than lose exp. Gear I can fix pretty quick and makes more sense, losing exp I have already gained feels like a waste of my time.

[fusional]

I rather have gear break than lose exp. Gear I can fix pretty quick and makes more sense, losing exp I have already gained feels like a waste of my time.

and here you've hit the nail on the head. while exp is technically extremely easy to get in this game (and in XI now), and while hitting a player in the wallet (repairs) technically hurts worse- the exp loss is more of an insult because it costs us time, and we have better shit to do with our time.

you can only stockpile so much exp, then you have to waste time to get back to cap. buying 10 stacks of grade 5 dark matter, by comparison, is far far less of a net loss of time. and so we prefer that option, as it doesn't needlessly distract us from what we *want* to do in the game by making us spend extra time doing something we *don't* (and shouldn't need to)

You're right, of course. I never tackled any difficult content in 1.0...

clearly. your lodestone history doesn't lie. unless you'd really be audacious enough to imply killing great buffalo like 2 years after it was ever relevant was somehow difficult, risky and noteworthy?

...and hence haven't died yet.

no, i'm sure you've died quote a lot, even on your trivialized content. which may have something to do with you never doing 17min speed runs, darnus hard, ifrit extreme... or even lowly garuda. and truly, i don't bring any of this up as an insult. people play at their own pace and that's perfectly fine.

i bring it up to give perspective, and to point out your lack of it. because it's easy for someone to talk big about things which they have little or no experience with. which leads me to this last little nugget-

Sorry, did you have a contribution to make?

yes, actually. my contribution will be to continue to push on the bleeding edge of new content, releasing videos and strategies and DPS rotations and healing tips so people can, you know...

...finish these fights with minimal deaths. and maybe improve as players!

should we discuss your contribution now? because all i see you doing is making shitty suggestions about things you have no understanding of.

[HiirNoivl]

I rather have gear break than lose exp. Gear I can fix pretty quick and makes more sense, losing exp I have already gained feels like a waste of my time.

And this is what it's all about. Even though the days are still the same 24 hour length all entertainment and media is competing for our time. Nowadays most people don't have time (or don't want to spend time) to level slowly, repeat content ad nauseum, have stupid pointless cool down timers, trek to and through the same areas repeatedly...

EXP loss and other penalties like it is a waste of time. It does 0 for fun, 0 for lore, 0 for content, and 0 for difficulty. Even the people who are FOR harsher death penalties see no real substantial benefit to it other than a nebulous, "you'll want to die less". Die less? How about making me want to play this game less? Meh, for me even waiting for weakness is painful. I got a skinny little window to squeeze some daily gaming time in. I don't want to waste it standing around or getting to 50 again. How much EXP was that to get to 50 anyway?

I'm in favor of a harsher death penalty, doesn't need to be exp loss, but harsh enough to make people think twice before doing something stupid.

Like what? Film themselves getting owned by Odin while wearing a pointy hat and a subligar?

That is fun. We need more fun in game. Anything that gets in the way of fun is bad for a game.

[Kallera]

And this is what it's all about. Even though the days are still the same 24 hour length all entertainment and media is competing for our time. Nowadays most people don't have time (or don't want to spend time) to level slowly, repeat content ad nauseum, have stupid pointless cool down timers, trek to and through the same areas repeatedly...

EXP loss and other penalties like it is a waste of time. It does 0 for fun, 0 for lore, 0 for content, and 0 for difficulty. Even the people who are FOR harsher death penalties see no real substantial benefit to it other than a nebulous, "you'll want to die less". Die less? How about making me want to play this game less? Meh, for me even waiting for weakness is painful. I got a skinny little window to squeeze some daily gaming time in. I don't want to waste it standing around or getting to 50 again. How much EXP was that to get to 50 anyway?



Like what? Film themselves getting owned by Odin while wearing a pointy hat and a subligar?

That is fun. We need more fun in game. Anything that gets in the way of fun is bad for a game.

Kinda abstract term for fun. Its like you don't want any measure of challenge or skill required to play this game. MMOs require people to play longer, not necessarily to play successful. If you have only an hour a week to squeeze in your gameplay, why are you trampling on the players that want more than an hour's worth of game? Perhaps you are the one getting in the way of fun.

[PimCarb]

I still do not understand why people keep saying go back to FFXI. This is the next FF right. Building on the base that has been established. Ow I am sorry no this has become a cookie cutter of every other game out there. What is the essence of FF? What made it the most profitable game Square Enix has ever made? This is what I have been pondering and yes the pain was part of it. The difficulty. The fact that you had to search out the quests. You did not have this big arrow just to follow around. The fact that you had to look for a party. If you want to solo yes there where ways and jobs for that. In the end you owned the character and you tasted the sweet sweet victory when you completed COP and other endgame story lines. And not everyone could do it. So go jump on the band wagon with all the other cloned games out there. GIVE ME SOMETHING BETTER THAN FFXI BY BUILDING ON IT AS A BASE.

[EinSoFZ]

I still do not understand why people keep saying go back to FFXI. This is the next FF right. Building on the base that has been established. Ow I am sorry no this has become a cookie cutter of every other game out there. What is the essence of FF? What made it the most profitable game Square Enix has ever made? This is what I have been pondering and yes the pain was part of it. The difficulty. The fact that you had to search out the quests. You did not have this big arrow just to follow around. The fact that you had to look for a party. If you want to solo yes there where ways and jobs for that. In the end you owned the character and you tasted the sweet sweet victory when you completed COP and other endgame story lines. And not everyone could do it. So go jump on the band wagon with all the other cloned games out there. GIVE ME SOMETHING BETTER THAN FFXI BY BUILDING ON IT AS A BASE.

Because they're using the argument of "If you like FFXI so much go play it" and pretty much ignoring the rest of what anyone wanting elements from XI says. It's a really narrow minded way of trying to destroy an argument with one sentence. Truth is, none of want to go back to XI but we do want to see ARR succeed and whether people like it or not the previous SE MMO did have a great deal of success. Using some of it's formula's surely couldn't hurt.

There were bad aspects to XI, but let's not throw it all out because this is supposed to be a new game. New game doesn't imply you can't borrow. In the years since the former MMO began, I think players have just gotten used to putting in less effort as a whole to get their MMO fix.

Hit us in the wallet with gear damage...? Having to fix my gear was never a money issue, it was just tedious and required no active sort of thinking on my part. Might as well make relics even easier to get so people with limited time to play games don't miss out on them. That's the kind of game it seems people want.

[Cendres]

There's a reason no one uses XP loss for death penalty anymore. Have you thought of that? They ARE building on XI as a base, but they are not copying every single element either as that would put them in the rut they've been trying so hard to get out of. Your suggestion is one of those things that no longer has a place due to people having grown past it. XP loss is a cheap death penalty anyway, if you want pain at least have a little imagination.

People need to fear death, in 1.0 death was nothing important, while in XI it was a real threat and people avoided it, and that was thrilling.

I'm in favor of a harsher death penalty, doesn't need to be exp loss, but harsh enough to make people think twice before doing something stupid.

Are you kidding me? As soon as repairs got expensive you bet I tried to avoid death....It would have been more painful if we didn't have ridiculous amounts of gil to throw around too.