A possible compromise between questing vs mob exp party grinding.

[Exn]

I cannot logically take the stance of "let's screw other people over" because it is impossible for me not to grind mobs while questing. "Screwing over" the grind group necessarily screws me over too, but the converse is not true. It is a completely one-sided argument coming from the grind people being unhappy that the rest of the community is not going to be forced into grouping.

Of course it's possible to not grind open world mobs while quest leveling... Its actually more effiecient in quest-based leveling to NOT grind random mobs and just focus on killing the target mobs only for the quests reward.

I haven't seen one 'grind person' request anyone to be forced into grouping.. So your claim that the 'grind ppl' are unhappy that the entire community isn't being forced into one particular playstyle is just ridiculous. I guess you ran out ideas and just want to make stuff up now.. So on that note, I'm moving on..

[Wolfie]

Of course it's possible to not grind open world mobs while quest leveling... Its actually more effiecient in quest-based leveling to NOT grind random mobs and just focus on killing the target mobs only for the quests reward.

I haven't seen one 'grind person' request anyone to be forced into grouping.. So your claim that the 'grind ppl' are unhappy that the entire community isn't being forced into one particular playstyle is just ridiculous. I guess you ran out ideas and just want to make stuff up now.. So on that note, I'm moving on..

I don't think you understand the logical implications of buffing or nerfing "questing" and "grinding". Grinding is something everyone does regardless of what else they are doing with the game. It is literally impossible not to end up grinding monsters while questing or doing dungeons or whatever, so any kind of nerf to that is also a direct nerf to the other leveling methods.

The "solutions" offered by the party grind group are almost always "get rid of X, get rid of Y, without party grinding the MMO sucks".

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...l=1#post936713
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...l=1#post937500

You ever notice how the "quest leveling" people never ask for things like nerfing grinding, or that allowing grinding is going to kill the game, or whatever? And that the grind people freak out any time that YoshiP says anything about FATE/Quests/Leves/something-not-grinding?

Yeah, you guys are like white people complaining that you're being oppressed by minorities.

[Exn]

I don't think you understand the logical implications of buffing or nerfing "questing" and "grinding". Grinding is something everyone does regardless of what else they are doing with the game. It is literally impossible not to end up grinding monsters while questing or doing dungeons or whatever, so any kind of nerf to that is also a direct nerf to the other leveling methods.

The "solutions" offered by the party grind group are almost always "get rid of X, get rid of Y, without party grinding the MMO sucks".

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...l=1#post936713
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...l=1#post937500

Stop trying change the topic by essentially defining the word 'Grind'. We were talking about pt based mob grinding vs quest based leveling. You do not need to pt grind on mobs in order to quest-based level, period. They are completely different leveling systems that can function independent of the other. Of course you can choose to mix it up if you want, as the 'grind ppl' have been suggesting..

Did you even read those links you posted? Neither requested that quest based leveling be removed as you claim, only that pt based mob grinding be supported fairly.. Ppl are allowed to not like quest based leveling just like you don't like pt grinds.

You ever notice how the "quest leveling" people never ask for things like nerfing grinding, or that allowing grinding is going to kill the game, or whatever? And that the grind people freak out any time that YoshiP says anything about FATE/Quests/Leves/something-not-grinding?.

Nope.

[Shurrikhan]

I don't think you understand the logical implications of buffing or nerfing "questing" and "grinding". Grinding is something everyone does regardless of what else they are doing with the game. It is literally impossible not to end up grinding monsters while questing or doing dungeons or whatever, so any kind of nerf to that is also a direct nerf to the other leveling methods.

The "solutions" offered by the party grind group are almost always "get rid of X, get rid of Y, without party grinding the MMO sucks".

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...l=1#post936713
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...l=1#post937500

You ever notice how the "quest leveling" people never ask for things like nerfing grinding, or that allowing grinding is going to kill the game, or whatever? And that the grind people freak out any time that YoshiP says anything about FATE/Quests/Leves/something-not-grinding?

Yeah, you guys are like white people complaining that you're being oppressed by minorities.

Unless the (stubbornly strong as in your above description) party-grind advocates were clearly in the majority, I don't get the simile.

I think the main reason though is that you can't really "go wrong" with grinding, probably because it's has nothing to it. Zero. It will only ever have what the players give it. Which then makes it highly individual, or because there are multiple individuals following some manner of unified actions over time, social. To be clear though, I don't really mean that in the positive sense alone. My point is the nothingness, which makes it the ultimate fall-back point. If you can enjoy yourself grinding, that says a lot about the combat and the community, frankly, two of the most fundamental basics of any MMO. If games can generally be broken into pillars of gameplay, story, and aesthetics, with the additional category of community or the like in MMOs, an enjoyable grinding experience is kind of like a proof of concept on two already.

For that reason, if quests are merely an outlet for gameplay (and outside of well written main quests, they are, merely, for gameplay), I'd prefer to start the pursuit of gameplay with grinding, and work my way up as is lucrative (not just conventional). A quest-grind solves nothing. It simply changes most of the much more variable-length, adaptable, party-useful, and skill-pursuable aspects of grinding into running and clicking. Refreshing at times, but less useful on the whole.

I don't mean to pretend that all this can successfully defend that viewpoint, but I do believe that this is where that view stems from. In short, it's a sort of fundamentalism that also lends itself towards adaptability by the players themselves.