Bullying on FFXIV

[Searious]

First off, no some people can say really awful things and it's not really a "minor annoyance" to have your feelings hurt. Other people's words do have more of an impact than "oh man this guy is annoying". It is very stressful to be the focus of someone who makes it their goal to make you unhappy.

Secondly, this is a video game. No one is really comparing it to real life bullying. Neither are close to one another and they both are handled completely different and any "back in my day" examples do not discredit the harm that online bullying does. Saying you can "turn it off" is also an invalid argument because now you have an issue where other people are forcing you to not be able to use a service that you pay for. It's like telling a kid who's bullied in school "Well you can always just drop out".

And lastly, no. /laugh spam does not compare to real life bullying but when done to harass someone In Conjunction With My Other Examples only adds to the emotional stress. Also, that type of argument you made is a complete fallacy anyways.

I guess my point is if you've been through or seen real bullying then online "bullying" won't seem like a big deal. Someone saying really mean things to me online isn't going to ruin my game experience or cause me emotional stress. If you've had real emotion stress in your life this is probably wouldn't bother you either..

I mean if someone saying "really mean things" to you is enough to cause emotional stuff how do you deal with other problems in life? Not to be insensitive but the best thing to do is develop a thicker skin. The fact that you're sensitive makes you a target for things like this. People only will only bother you on the internet if they know you'll let it get under your skin. Don't give people that power to ruin your gaming experience. It's just words and emotes. Nothing more.

[Yves]

I guess my point is if you've been through or seen real bullying then online "bullying" won't seem like a big deal. Someone saying really mean things to me online isn't going to ruin my game experience or cause me emotional stress. If you've had real emotion stress in your life this is probably wouldn't bother you either..

I mean if someone saying "really mean things" to you is enough to cause emotional stuff how do you deal with other problems in life? Not to be insensitive but the best thing to do is develop a thicker skin. The fact that you're sensitive makes you a target for things like this. People only will only bother you on the internet if they know you'll let it get under your skin. Don't give people that power to ruin your gaming experience. It's just words and emotes. Nothing more.

Yeah, I can get on-board with this, Searious. The only thing that I would say is that - and this is a sad truth - some people allow online games to consume their existence. Their online personae becomes more valuable to them then their actual physical manifestation. In these extreme and rare cases (I wonder how rare they are?) bullying can be detrimental.

At the same time, if someone develops this then there are a whole boatload of other issues that need to be addressed aside from bullying.

[AmyNeudaiz]

I guess my point is if you've been through or seen real bullying then online "bullying" won't seem like a big deal.

My point is simply that they need to start actually having a presence in the game where people who ruin your gaming experience get punished for it. Developing thick skin has nothing to do with the matter. I am only adding to that core point with arguments from emotion that give reason to my suggestion.

Saying "deal with it" or "just turn your game off" or "grow thicker skin" only gets off the main point that SE needs to solve this community issue. My hope is that they have an actual GM service that does something about online harassment.

[Aethelinda]

My point is simply that they need to start actually having a presence in the game where people who ruin your gaming experience get punished for it. Developing thick skin has nothing to do with the matter. I am only adding to that core point with arguments from emotion that give reason to my suggestion.

Saying "deal with it" or "just turn your game off" or "grow thicker skin" only gets off the main point that SE needs to solve this community issue. My hope is that they have an actual GM service that does something about online harassment.

I definitely agree with you. You are my hero too ^^

[Denmo]

My point is simply that they need to start actually having a presence in the game where people who ruin your gaming experience get punished for it. Developing thick skin has nothing to do with the matter. I am only adding to that core point with arguments from emotion that give reason to my suggestion.

Saying "deal with it" or "just turn your game off" or "grow thicker skin" only gets off the main point that SE needs to solve this community issue. My hope is that they have an actual GM service that does something about online harassment.

So, you got me thinking.

I don't think SE need be involved any more than necessary. It'd have to be fair for everyone, something with minimal involvement on SE's part, and something that wouldn't ruin the game for those that weren't jerks in the first place.

The only thing I can think of is a player feedback system. You would rate a player with a point, positive or negative, after playing with them. Good teamwork and behavior is rewarded with likes and bad behavior is given dislikes or negative reports. Or just do "likes" and leave out negative stuff because everyone hates negativity way more than they like positivism. Either way, once enough points are accumulated and people get around, everyone would have a much better idea about the types of players they're playing with, and jerks/bullies/assholes would have to straighten up or face being ostracized by the community.

That would be the only way I could see SE fixing this sort of thing.

Either that or, not do anything, and just let players sort it out for themselves. Thicker skins and/or more restrictive groups. I recall in XI, most jerks were ostracized pretty quickly because they were ruining the EXP flow and the group's enjoyment. You remembered names of bad players. Not so much in XIV 1.0, where level 50 is pretty easy to obtain....

[AmyNeudaiz]

It'd have to be fair for everyone

If by "fair" you mean nothing happens to someone who harasses others with no consequence other than some people knowing they are a jerk, then I do not see the justice in that.

I'm not asking for insane bans like Microsoft does on XBL, just warnings and/or temporary jail like they used to do. It's not too much to ask for.

Yes it does. If you develop a thicker skin these people won't be able to bother you. It will help in other areas of you life as well. If some silly kids in online are enough to cause you emotional stress I can't imagine what kind of effect something more serious might have on you.


Not sure how it does but I wish you the best of luck. Nothing bad bad can come from growing thicker skin.

Again with the fallacies. Why do you bring up Real Life in a debate about an MMO? Why ask how I deal other things? I have enough stress in my life without people harassing me and I come to this Video Game made for Entertainment and Fun. Not to "grow thick skin".

At this time I can go off and MPK someone, swear at them till my fingertips are blue, threaten them, spread complete lies about them, get them kicked out of an LS by lying to the LS leader about things they did, cause a complete commotion and cause all sorts of drama and piss off as many people as I want and NOTHING would happen. How do you think this is okay and "fixed" by thick skin?

[Denmo]

If by "fair" you mean nothing happens to someone who harasses others with no consequence other than some people knowing they are a jerk, then I do not see the justice in that.

A GM has to investigate - there's no way they can just toss someone in jail just because a player said so. A bad reputation does have an effect on jerks, even though they may not see it right away.

I'm not asking for insane bans like Microsoft does on XBL, just warnings and/or temporary jail like they used to do. It's not too much to ask for.

I agree, but I wouldn't count on it before 2.0.

You got a good idea there but what about people just didn't like how you played or they just didn't like your opinion at some point while running with then? Then they can just be mean and rate you based on their feeling towards you.

Well yeah, that's how it'd work. People would be rating you based on how they felt the rating should mean. Everyone would get bad points, but after 1000 ratings, your character would be mostly accurately portrayed, even if you say, had a bad grouchy night or two. And I think that if you are generally a nice person, earnest, and try hard, people will sense that and rate you with good marks.

This reputation system exists in many other games, and they usually work as intended.

[AmyNeudaiz]

A GM has to investigate - there's no way they can just toss someone in jail just because a player said so. A bad reputation does have an effect on jerks, even though they may not see it right away.

You misunderstand my point. I am not asking for people to get banned for no reason.

TLDR: The bullied are normally instigating shit.

This is not the case. A lot of people came to me when bullied when I ran a larger LS and I can say that my personal experience says otherwise. Yes, there are those who incite drama and point fingers but that does not discredit the legitimate problem of online harassment.

[Aethelinda]

Well yeah, that's how it'd work. People would be rating you based on how they felt the rating should mean. Everyone would get bad points, but after 1000 ratings, your character would be mostly accurately portrayed, even if you say, had a bad grouchy night or two. And I think that if you are generally a nice person, earnest, and try hard, people will sense that and rate you with good marks.

This reputation system exists in many other games, and they usually work as intended.

Sounds good to me

[Searious]

If by "fair" you mean nothing happens to someone who harasses others with no consequence other than some people knowing they are a jerk, then I do not see the justice in that.

I'm not asking for insane bans like Microsoft does on XBL, just warnings and/or temporary jail like they used to do. It's not too much to ask for.



Again with the fallacies. Why do you bring up Real Life in a debate about an MMO? Why ask how I deal other things? I have enough stress in my life without people harassing me and I come to this Video Game made for Entertainment and Fun. Not to "grow thick skin".

The first line you bolded is referring to the game not real life. Apparently anything you dont agree with is a fallacy. From what I'm gethering from your responsesis you don't want to try to solve your "problem" yourself and you just want SE to handle it for you.

At this time I can go off and MPK someone,

I got MPKed yesterday. Minor annoyance.

swear at them till my fingertips are blue

Block them. Minor annoyance.

threaten them

Empty threats on the internet. Minor annoyance.

spread complete lies about them,

Lies about you to people you'll probbaly never meet. Why do you even care?

get them kicked out of an LS by lying to the LS leader about things they did, cause a complete commotion and cause all sorts of drama and piss off as many people as I want and NOTHING would happen. How do you think this is okay and "fixed" by thick skin?

Get a new LS. People do it all the time. There are plenty in the game. What would SE even be do about this anyway?

So far nothing you said convinced me there's a huge problem in the game that SE needs to address. All the things you listed are annoying at best. None of these things should cause you any "emotional stress." You can find these things in any game online so if you can't deal it the only thing I can suggest is playing some console game where you don't have to interact with anyone.