Excuses & Daily Updates

[Grimm]

And there's also the fact Yoshida said he'll never do a wipe. So if they add something they need to make sure it's not exploitable.

There is always test servers.

[Corrderio]

There is always test servers.

Which we don't have ATM

[Grimm]

Which we don't have ATM

I think we can both agree that FFXIV needs them more than FFXI.

[Corrderio]

I think we can both agree that FFXIV needs them more than FFXI.

Pretty much yeah, would make a good suggestion since I'm sure a lot of people would agree.

[Abriael]

There is always test servers.

Test servers never get enough traffic to be a surefire vaccine against exploits and problems. That applies basically every game.
Most people don't really "waste" time on test servers when they can be playing on the live ones and work on their character progression.

That's elitism, which is found in every MMO community, I just ignore people who speak like that much like high level mages will say "protect and shell is broken, you aren't a 50 mage so you don't know!" yet others can see it has some effect even as a subskill on Marauder.

It's not a matter of elitism. And it's not even a matter of getting to 50. People that talk a lot about things that they simply didn't experience first hand don't hold much credibility.
Even worse, people that didn't play the game for months don't have many tools to actually judge the current state of the game.

[Grimm]

Test servers never get enough traffic to be a surefire vaccine against exploits and problems. That's in every game.

If everyone want's this game fixed as bad as they claim there will be no problem with that.

[Abriael]

If everyone want's this game fixed as bad as they claim there will be no problem with that.

Everyone wants games improved very vocally in every game I played before.
When it's time to take it upon themselves to use their own time to actually help improving the game by playing on test servers, the developer needs to literally *beg* them to, and use actual development time to devise events and incentives to drag them into it.
And even then, I've never seen a test server with an even decent population (which partly defeats the purpose of even having a test server, mind you).

And mind you, I'm a strong supporter (and user) of test servers, and I believe that Yoshida actually promised their implementation. Though, they are not a be all, end all solution because of their low population.
Not to mention that most of the people that go there in every game, just do so to get a sneak peek of the changes, without having any intention to actually test and send constructive feedback.

There's a lot of difference between demanding improvement vocally, and willing to contribute to improvement practically and constructively. In my (rather long and extensive) MMORPG experience I've seen a lot of the first, much, much less of the second.

[Grimm]

Everyone wants games improved very vocally in every game I played before.
When it's time to take it upon themselves to use their own time to actually help improving the game by playing on test servers, the developer needs to literally *beg* them to, and use actual development time to devise events and incentives to drag them into it.
And even then, I've never seen a test server with an even decent population (which partly defeats the purpose of even having a test server, mind you).

And mind you, I'm a strong supporter (and user) of test servers, and I believe that Yoshida actually promised their implementation. Though, they are not a be all, end all solution because of their low population.
Not to mention that most of the people that go there in every game, just do so to get a sneak peek of the changes, without having any intention to actually test and send constructive feedback.

While I agree most people won't test properly I will test my ass off. What they can do is use the first OPEN test server as a way to find out who will actually test the content and invite them to later closed testing. Just an idea even thought it would be a pain to do.

[Abriael]

While I agree most people won't test properly I will test my ass off. What they can do is use the first OPEN test server as a way to find out who will actually test the content and invite them to later closed testing. Just an idea even thought it would be a pain to do.

I'm sure they will have a test server, and i'm sure some will test. I know I will. Just saying that it won't be a be all end all solution, as their effectiveness in other games is rather limited. They're good to find bugs (depending on attendance and activity), but they aren't a good decisional tool, nor they're good for a game's forums, as too many people take what they see on test servers as a final product.

LMFAO, REALLY? You have lvl/rnk 1000 in a game makes you feel special, and validates you as a human and gives you merit to insult thoes puny ppl w/o high lvl jobs in a game?

This is a typical strawman argument. I'm sure no one around here accused low levels to be less than human or insulted them just for the fact that they are low levels.

There's a big difference between that and saying that you need to experience things first hand if you want to have much credibility when discussing about them. Talking about what you don't know isn't exactly conductive to constructive discussion.