Wait a sec... Let me get this straight...

[Searious]

Because we want SE to make Warrior deal insane damage and tank well with very little effort... Great idea bro. Paladin also got a bit of a buff with the changes, it's just that Warrior is still an easy class to tank as, it is sickening. I feel things are just about right, with the exception of the miss rate melee classes have to deal with.

Let's just put the warrior job in it's place as a trash mob/secondary tank and we'll have more variety in dungeon runs. I might sound a bit harsh.. but it's only because I'm very sensitive about this subject.

Why are plds always such crybabies when there's another tank alternative? When every there's another tank you can be sure Paladins will be crying for them to be nerfed. Even in FF11. "Oh Noes ppl r inviting Ninjas! It take more than 5 mins to get a prty invite now.

[Dzian]

They changed the decay speed on rampage so that its harder to have a fully powered rampage vs a single mob but still fairly easy to have a fully powered rampage against multiple. a warrior is stronger the more stuffs beats on him.
for that reason if i find for some reason im about dead soloing a sentry in natalan i will deliberately run out and pull a few more mobs.

to some degree you can use enduring march as it prevents rampage from decaying. does have a long cool down though but can be helpfull at times.

[Judge_Xero]

Probably already been discussed, but a reason that ENM+ is more suited to MRD/WAR is because of the higher base damage they have.

@ 0.1% per Enmity Stat PLD doesn't see much gain from damage dealt. (only static abilities i.e. Flash, Rampart)

So if PLD had the +50 ENM on Curtana

PLD: 120 DMG (Total 126 ENM) 6 Extra

VS Bravura

WAR: 320 DMG (Total 336 EMN) 16 Extra

So you see where adding 10 STR > 50 ENM on PLD

But for WAR 20 STR > 50 ENM. Since ENM+ effects all actions, the line comes a bit closer to what has the greatest effect overall for WAR.

(That and WAR only needs STR + VIT + ENM, whereas PLD needs STR + VIT + MND + ENM)

[buritoslicer]

Why are plds always such crybabies when there's another tank alternative? When every there's another tank you can be sure Paladins will be crying for them to be nerfed. Even in FF11. "Oh Noes ppl r inviting Ninjas! It take more than 5 mins to get a prty invite now.

I'm not QQ'ing about anything. I think warrior is a nice class, a great side tank/trash tank. But Paladin is better in most situations tanking wise, Better survivability and more group support (my health is 300 hp behind a decent warriors so no low health argument is valid). Please take note Paladin isn't my only class, as I have warrior at 50 and I use that job too when situations require.

So tell me, how am I being a crybaby Mr. Lancer? Tell me how your expertise in Archery and Lancer make your argument valid? Do you even have your tank classes up? DO YOU EVEN TANK? I don't think so. You should have kept quiet in a discussion about tanking.

[Aceofspades]

Why are plds always such crybabies when there's another tank alternative? When every there's another tank you can be sure Paladins will be crying for them to be nerfed. Even in FF11. "Oh Noes ppl r inviting Ninjas! It take more than 5 mins to get a prty invite now.

excuse me while I LOL @ this. Back before they made changes to WAR, those who actually tanked on PLD, most were advocating that PLD didnt need changes to be a viable tank, and certainly did better job against single target fights, or at least I did. It was the constant crying from the WAR TANKS! whom were complaining about how useless pld was and how op war was to pld that , if anything, could be used as a contributer to the changes. However, that being said, Upon changes SE did say that the dps output and enmity gain on war being soo strong , was an UNINTENDED result. SE basicly just gave war massive aoe DD along with super strong hate abilities soo that they covered both tank and dd bases, what they failed to do before they released the job was put a govenor between the two soo that WAR couldnt do both masive dd AND tank. It wasnt a gimp, it was a adjustment to allow WARs to decide a general direction, tank or dd, not both as that would obviously be OP in any situation. Example, Imagine if BLM had the same damage mitigation as PLD, why would anyone bring a PLD, same effect when war had no govenor between dps set up and tank set up.

[Churchill]

..wat&wat..

[Searious]

I'm not QQ'ing about anything. I think warrior is a nice class, a great side tank/trash tank. But Paladin is better in most situations tanking wise, Better survivability and more group support (my health is 300 hp behind a decent warriors so no low health argument is valid). Please take note Paladin isn't my only class, as I have warrior at 50 and I use that job too when situations require.

So tell me, how am I being a crybaby Mr. Lancer? Tell me how your expertise in Archery and Lancer make your argument valid? Do you even have your tank classes up? DO YOU EVEN TANK? I don't think so. You should have kept quiet in a discussion about tanking.

Do I even tank? DO YOU EVEN READ? I don't think so. I wasn't talking about the technical aspects of tanking. Or even tanking in general really. I'm commenting on Paladins constantly crying about other tanks. How does that require any tanking experience? I only need to be able to read forum post of Paladins crying for that. Back in FFXI it was Paladins crying about Ninjas. Now it's Paladins crying about Warriors. If they add another tanking class later Paladins will probably cry about them too. That's not knowledge you need to level a tank class for. Go workin on your reading comprehension skills please. Get those up to 50 next.

[Aceofspades]

Do I even tank? DO YOU EVEN READ? I don't think so. I wasn't talking about the technical aspects of tanking. Or even tanking in general really. I'm commenting on Paladins constantly crying about other tanks. How does that require any tanking experience? I only need to be able to read forum post of Paladins crying for that. Back in FFXI it was Paladins crying about Ninjas. Now it's Paladins crying about Warriors. If they add another tanking class later Paladins will probably cry about them too. That's not knowledge you need to level a tank class for. Go workin on your reading comprehension skills please. Get those up to 50 next.

lmfao, yes, to comment on a class/job , whatever the comment may be about, it would be vital for anyone to know wtf they are talking about, wich you apreantly do not. You obviously bit off more then you can chew, how bout we give you a mulligan and let you delte this thread. But I promise, if you insist on this rant in wich you are completely clueless as to what you talking about, it will not go your way.

[Searious]

Oh no not you too. You would have a point if I was commenting on the class/job itself and not certain players who play the class instead. I wasn't so you don't. In my original post I never said whether I agreed or disagreed with Burrito Slicer's complaint about Warrior. I'm talking about seeing paladins complain for years and years and you're acting like I'm trying to discuss the finer points of tanking. The only thing leveling the class would do in this particular situation is maybe give me more insight on why people are crybabies in the first place. That was the reason I posted the question in the first place. What's going to happen now? You two are going to type at me at all caps?

[Judge_Xero]

The only thing leveling the class would do in this particular situation is maybe give me more insight on why people are crybabies in the first place. That was the reason I posted the question in the first place. What's going to happen now? You two are going to type at me at all caps?

Not sure about how FFXI was. But for FFXIV the reason for the QQing was because PLD was more difficult to use as a tank. Most of the complaining seemed to come from Warriors that were trying out Paladin. They realized that Warrior as it was, was so much easier to Tank with, and due to the complaining of it "sucking", many decent Paladins were left out of parties.

Now with the adjustments, forums, and practice, people are realizing Paladin and Warrior are both effective, and each slightly better in their own situations.

The complaining stems from good Paladins getting shafted in parties because of the mindset that Paladin sucks. Which is perfectly understandable, because why would a PUG take a chance that a PLD may not be good, when 9/10 WAR's get the job done.

I'm glad that's all in the wind now.