How would you feel is level caps were integrated with the Main Story quests?

[Jocko]

No. Level caps just fracture the player base even more and create unnecessary barriers towards progression.

Level caps should never occur ever again.

How do they fracture the player base in any way, shape, or form?

[Jennestia]

How do they fracture the player base in any way, shape, or form?

It doesn't at all, the fact he said "Level caps should never occur ever again" basically means he's only thinking about players at level cap, not the players that'll matter most to SE if they want to see this game get off the ground -- level caps aren't a bad thing and the only people who'll truly have an issue with it are those the content wasn't designed for, as in level 25 Ifrit quest clearly wasn't designed for level 50s, which means a level cap of 25 won't bother a party of level 25s like it would a party of 50s.

There's content separation and level caps are just another way of balancing content for appropriate ranges. Using that as an example how does:

1. A party consisting of players level 25 get affected by a level cap on content of 25?

A: It doesn't, if it affected anyone it would be level 50 doing level 25 content.

[EmSix]

It doesn't at all, the fact he said "Level caps should never occur ever again" basically means he's only thinking about players at level cap, not the players that'll matter most to SE if they want to see this game get off the ground -- level caps aren't a bad thing and the only people who'll truly have an issue with it are those the content wasn't designed for, as in level 25 Ifrit quest clearly wasn't designed for level 50s, which means a level cap of 25 won't bother a party of level 25s like it would a party of 50s.

There's content separation and level caps are just another way of balancing content for appropriate ranges. Using that as an example how does:

1. A party consisting of players level 25 get affected by a level cap on content of 25?

A: It doesn't, if it affected anyone it would be level 50 doing level 25 content.

Do you remember CoP? It won't work out like the way you say at all if they're integrated into an entire storyline.

[Platinumstorm]

How do they fracture the player base in any way, shape, or form?

Because you create barriers for lower levels to progress because it's outdated content. This puts an additional burden on lower level players and holds them back from catching up with the main content focus.

[Tibian]

How do they fracture the player base in any way, shape, or form?

Because players don't go back and do old content. It happened all the time in XI. Furthermore, when you sync people down to the "appropriate content level" it just makes veteran players even LESS likely to go back and help. At least give these new players (with high level friends) the opportunity to experience the story (with a quick run through) and then get on the same content as the rest of the player base.

Saying "find a helpful linkshell" is not an appropriate response either. If you go help these poor people, good for you, but 95% of the population will not help a random stranger shouting trying to assemble a group for outdated content. Remember CoP, Prommies? Same garbage situation that you're presenting in this thread.

More realistically, how many of you will go back and do HAMLET once you finish all of your seals? "Good luck with that right?"

So while all the old players and their cliques successfully clear content, the poor new guy who needs to assemble a group of (most likely eight) people that are all on this specific quest, (and actually know how to clear content well) will end up being stuck at the specific mission quest that prevents them from continuing even further in the story and catching up to the main content player base.

Do you know what happens when people are literally "prevented" from progressing further in a game? They quit. Why? Not because they are lazy, or slackers, or entitled to instant satisfaction, but because they are presented with a barrier that foreshadows a continuously punishing cycle that these poor new players will never get to the main content that is currently active.

Abyssea was the solution to this problem in XI, and a majority of you HATE and LOATHE it without understanding the fact that it was NECESSARY to sustain the longevity and life of FFXI. It was necessary to close the MASSIVE gap that XI created in a content and level base.

This is why level caps on content should not exist, and this is why level caps on anything contribute further to fracturing the player base.

[Jocko]

Because players don't go back and do old content

You're talking about two completely different issues here. What does that have to do with level cap? If players aren't going to do old content, then they aren't going to do old content, regardless of level caps. If a player needs to complete old content to advance, they'll have to find a party, and I doubt that required level synching is going to be the difference between 'Sure, I'll help' and '**** off'.

You're also forgetting XIV's fundamental difference; the game is designed around leveling and maintaining multiple jobs. There's always room for advancement because multiple skills from every job can be shared. With proper level pacing, there should always be a large percentage of the player base with something to gain, whether it's experience or gear for all of the jobs you're expected to level.

[darkstarpoet1]

You're talking about two completely different issues here. What does that have to do with level cap? If players aren't going to do old content, then they aren't going to do old content, regardless of level caps. If a player needs to complete old content to advance, they'll have to find a party, and I doubt that required level synching is going to be the difference between 'Sure, I'll help' and '**** off'.

actually you are off base here. i see many people shouting for help on lower level content all the time. normally it's a high level player that will go help them run it just because it won't take long to go in and steamroll something. i'm glad to go help someone do toto-rak because i can run through it and knock it off their list quickly, but i won't be as willing to do it if it takes a long time. adding a level sync is just a good way to stop me from being willing to go help someone do lower level content when they can't find a group their level to go do it.

is it as much fun for the low level player to get a high level person to go do the content for them? no, but i can assure you it's more fun than sitting there for hours and not being able to get anyone to help them at all.

[Maxthunder]

actually you are off base here. i see many people shouting for help on lower level content all the time. normally it's a high level player that will go help them run it just because it won't take long to go in and steamroll something. i'm glad to go help someone do toto-rak because i can run through it and knock it off their list quickly, but i won't be as willing to do it if it takes a long time. adding a level sync is just a good way to stop me from being willing to go help someone do lower level content when they can't find a group their level to go do it.

is it as much fun for the low level player to get a high level person to go do the content for them? no, but i can assure you it's more fun than sitting there for hours and not being able to get anyone to help them at all.

I agree with you, and if there was a level cap i guarentee I would not be helping any low levels period.

[Jocko]

I agree with you, and if there was a level cap i guarentee I would not be helping any low levels period.

If the repeatable content offered you, say, a seal reward? Would you then?

[Viritess]

Because players don't go back and do old content. It happened all the time in XI. Furthermore, when you sync people down to the "appropriate content level" it just makes veteran players even LESS likely to go back and help. At least give these new players (with high level friends) the opportunity to experience the story (with a quick run through) and then get on the same content as the rest of the player base.

Saying "find a helpful linkshell" is not an appropriate response either. If you go help these poor people, good for you, but 95% of the population will not help a random stranger shouting trying to assemble a group for outdated content. Remember CoP, Prommies? Same garbage situation that you're presenting in this thread.

More realistically, how many of you will go back and do HAMLET once you finish all of your seals? "Good luck with that right?"

So while all the old players and their cliques successfully clear content, the poor new guy who needs to assemble a group of (most likely eight) people that are all on this specific quest, (and actually know how to clear content well) will end up being stuck at the specific mission quest that prevents them from continuing even further in the story and catching up to the main content player base.

Do you know what happens when people are literally "prevented" from progressing further in a game? They quit. Why? Not because they are lazy, or slackers, or entitled to instant satisfaction, but because they are presented with a barrier that foreshadows a continuously punishing cycle that these poor new players will never get to the main content that is currently active.

Abyssea was the solution to this problem in XI, and a majority of you HATE and LOATHE it without understanding the fact that it was NECESSARY to sustain the longevity and life of FFXI. It was necessary to close the MASSIVE gap that XI created in a content and level base.

This is why level caps on content should not exist, and this is why level caps on anything contribute further to fracturing the player base.

I have no FF11 experience. But besides the specifics, i agree with the sentiment. When i started in FF14 Imperial devices was a sort of roadblock for me. It took me weeks for someone to be willing to help a new player with no LS yet (Thanks again Bishop ^^ ) to finish the quest.

I was run through, by a lvl 50. The content was done, but i didn't do it. I just followed behind and then talked to the NPC. I'm still grateful i could get it done. And this wasn't even a Level Roadblock. The only thing that brought folks to Toto-rak after was seals. It was then abandoned again when Chocobo Escourts and the like got buffed.

Later on i've run a few new folks through Imperial Devices, just like Bishop did for me. I warn them "I'll help ya, but its more fun with people of your level" and almost always the responce is "I just want to get it done finally".

And this isn't even a Roadblock to leveling. The only time you can expect everyone to do something at the same time is day of release. After that, it gets harder even faster. Unless you get "+5% drop rate in Toto-rak when party includes 2 lvl 30 or below players" Your not likely to see alot of people helping.

Its a shame, but its also understandable. Theres a reason Getting Hamlet provisioner is easier and easier, cause less people are fighting over the top 3. Or the 20 at all. Folks are finished with it. And even if you give some reason, be it seals, points whatever, not everyone, and possibly not even alot, are gonna go back anyway.

Its a neat idea in theory, but the persistance of MMOs is in part why i think the idea doesn't work. If we were all reset every 6 months then the new people would have use back doing it again. But i doubt anyone wants to start over every 6 months.