Dungeons & Raids Are Too Easy

[AngryLion]

Dungeons and raids in this game are too easy except for Savage. It is no fun at all. Seriously, you don't need to anything. If 1 player is AFK, the remaining players can easily complete. I can complete many of them with my eyes closed. Dumbing down content (especially the older expansions) is a very bad design. Make them challenging again. iLvL and Level sync should be forced for all instances.

What is the point of playing a game that you always win?

[DPZ2]

What is the point of playing a game that you always win?

The same reason people read a book to the end even though they know the heroes will probably win. Not every part of a game is meant to be a test of skill.

Normal dungeons and raids exist to move the story forward and give players a shared experience. Challenging content exists for players who want to be tested. FFXIV deliberately separates those goals rather than making every piece of content a progression wall.

If the MSQ required Savage-level execution, a large portion of the player base would simply never finish the story. The goal of normal content is accessibility, not mastery.

[Nestama]

I think what they really need to stop doing is having boss fights go through a "tutorial phase" for the first minute (three or more if a trial and normal/alliance raid). Tutorial phases are a detriment to replayability and become the only thing you ever see once everyone outgears the content (ESPECIALLY in Alliance Raids). I'm also beginning to think they're severely impacting what the battle dev team can do when it comes to making unique fights with fun mechanics.

When Rabanastre is still more interesting and more fun to do than both Myths and Vana'diel raids overall, something is very wrong.

[Allistar]

I'm sure there are other games out there that will challenge your veil of superiority to us poor unskilled filthy casuals

[Sorabaka]

The same reason people read a book to the end even though they know the heroes will probably win. Not every part of a game is meant to be a test of skill.

Normal dungeons and raids exist to move the story forward and give players a shared experience. Challenging content exists for players who want to be tested. FFXIV deliberately separates those goals rather than making every piece of content a progression wall.

If the MSQ required Savage-level execution, a large portion of the player base would simply never finish the story. The goal of normal content is accessibility, not mastery.

I love when people think in absolutes. For ppl like you it's either no effort required and you can't die, or savage level mechanics that only no-lifers can do. Well, if you compare wanting to do nothing while getting everything to reading a book, then i can propose to you a unique idea of literally not playing a game, and just watching cutscenes on youtube. Nobody saying dungeons should have savage mechanics. But most players also want some engagement and challenge from a game they choose to spend their time on. The thing it, even DT bosses are not challenging in the slightest to a raider, but they are a sweet spot where they DO actually offer a little challenge to a casual player. To a CASUAL player, not to a crybaby from the forums, who claims to watch 20 different guides and still failing. And even if you are a raider, you still have some mechanics you have to pay attention to, like the first boss of Alexandria for example.

Proposing dumbing down the game to the point where you are a literal walking god that cannot die, strolling through a dungeon, because you can't be bothered to turn your brain on for 10 minutes, is very egotistical.

Stop using your laziness as an excuse. I know quite a few actual CASUAL players who do savage in their spare time, without having to play a lot. And some actual casual players even do ultimates. Maybe not on patch, but they do them anyway. They don't spend all their time crying that the dungeon boss is too hard because it doesn't show every attack as a red circle on the ground 15 seconds in advance.

[Sorabaka]

I kinda agree with that, tbf, but that is the design that is supposed to help a casual player understand how mechanics work. As long as they use their brain instead of running around like a headless chicken during a cast and then crying on the forums. So i'm not really complaining about that. Ivalice and NIER were peak ARs imo. The latest one s are...weak, yeah.

[Falak]

I love when people think in absolutes. For ppl like you it's either no effort required and you can't die, or savage level mechanics that only no-lifers can do. Well, if you compare wanting to do nothing while getting everything to reading a book, then i can propose to you a unique idea of literally not playing a game, and just watching cutscenes on youtube. Nobody saying dungeons should have savage mechanics. But most players also want some engagement and challenge from a game they choose to spend their time on. The thing it, even DT bosses are not challenging in the slightest to a raider, but they are a sweet spot where they DO actually offer a little challenge to a casual player. To a CASUAL player, not to a crybaby from the forums, who claims to watch 20 different guides and still failing. And even if you are a raider, you still have some mechanics you have to pay attention to, like the first boss of Alexandria for example.

Proposing dumbing down the game to the point where you are a literal walking god that cannot die, strolling through a dungeon, because you can't be bothered to turn your brain on for 10 minutes, is very egotistical.

Stop using your laziness as an excuse. I know quite a few actual CASUAL players who do savage in their spare time, without having to play a lot. And some actual casual players even do ultimates. Maybe not on patch, but they do them anyway. They don't spend all their time crying that the dungeon boss is too hard because it doesn't show every attack as a red circle on the ground 15 seconds in advance.

They never said any of that you complete psycho. They said normal content is meant to be accessible, which it is. It's story mode content that everyone can play. If people want to do challenging content then that also exists and there's content in between that like EX's, Advanced Criterion, the new Fierce raids etc.

[Sorabaka]

They never said any of that you complete psycho. They said normal content is meant to be accessible, which it is. It's story mode content that everyone can play. If people want to do challenging content then that also exists and there's content in between that like EX's, Advanced Criterion, the new Fierce raids etc.

> If the MSQ required Savage-level execution

> They never said any of that

Brother you need glasses.

[Falak]

Seek help.

[DPZ2]

snip

What a response. Nobody proposed "dumbing down the game," and nobody asked for Savage mechanics in dungeons either.

The original complaint was that normal dungeons and raids have become so forgiving that player engagement often feels optional. That's a discussion about where the difficulty curve should sit, not an argument that everyone should either be a walking god or be clearing Ultimates.

The irony is that your post spends more time attacking imaginary players than addressing the actual points being made. If the current Dawntrail dungeon design is a good middle ground, make that case. Arguing against "people who want to do nothing and get everything" doesn't respond to what was actually said.

There's a difference between arguing against my position and arguing against the version of my position that exists in your head. If you believe Dawntrail's dungeon design is the right balance, that's a perfectly valid opinion and one worth discussing. But responding to arguments nobody made doesn't actually address the concerns being raised about engagement, encounter design, or where normal content should sit on the difficulty spectrum.