UNDERCUTTING....

[Kiara]

Hi! Thanks for your input. I'll respond in order of your points.

RMTs can control prices using the methods you described to an extent, but items still have inherent value. If they try to inflate the price of a Tier IV materia for some reason, people are likely to notice that the item is disproportionately priced with respect to other similar materia or items. I guess it goes back to how covert this manipulation is-- 10k will probably not be noticed, but 100k likely will and subsequently adjusted for.

There is no price regulation for sure. The closest thing to this is NPC prices for items that can be used as a benchmark/estimate for how much the market will be charging... but again, even these prices appear to have been arbitrarily selected, with no real account for actual supply/demand dynamics. As far as anti-inflation measures, there are only two basic tactics that SE used in XI and is likely to employ in XIV: gil sinks (such as the repair NPC), and gil seizures (banning of RMT accounts that horde gil). I guess the bottom line here is that we'll probably never see any sophisticated price controls/regulations put into place. This is an MMO after all; I don't think SE has budgeted to hire an economist to manage the XIV economies.

In terms of activity, an economy can't function as a market if there aren't enough buyers and sellers. This is a really complicated problem that I'm too lazy, and honestly, probably not knowledgeable enough to speak to. All I'll say is that with more people there are more transactions and a greater likelihood of normal market behaviours.

Hi Onion,

Thanks again for the thoughtful reply.

Some great points. I really wish SE would hire a dedicated "Anti-Trust / Monopoly" Team (or put in engine checks) to see when potential Dumping would occur.

As you said, I think RMT Corporations could price dump and drive out real crafters & gatherers, and slowly increment their controlled market prices (keeping it super low, but with their army of bots / possessed Lalafell, they could probably earn a steady income at whatever pricing scheme they chose to run with, whether it was super low to keep regular players away, or suddenly jacking things up, and then price dumping again if people came in).

It's definitely a very complicated issue / situation and I'd say at least in some ways, XIV has been much more friendly to players to bypass RMT controlled situations: An individual player can take the time to farm their own mats (or with the help of a friend or two) and craft their own gear (or get real players to do it, etc.).

With most valuable Max Level Drops being U/U right now, that also effectively cuts out RMT Corporations as well.

I'll be curious to see how this develops later.

[KoujiGeki]

Dude ppl undercut even when we had no price history word just got around this item was selling for this much and it still happened. Just a few ppl in here butt hurt they can't sell new items for 10 mil gil when none of the mats cost that much to make it.

I love when ppl use the line they are only hurting them selves. You can only hurt your self when you sell stuff more than what npc's sell the items for, or not making a profit at all, at the end of the day if i got all my items for free and decide i want to undercut you to make 100% profit i will do it >_>.

agreed. 100%

[Lux_Rayna]

Hi Onion,

Thanks again for the thoughtful reply.

Some great points. I really wish SE would hire a dedicated "Anti-Trust / Monopoly" Team (or put in engine checks) to see when potential Dumping would occur.

As you said, I think RMT Corporations could price dump and drive out real crafters & gatherers, and slowly increment their controlled market prices (keeping it super low, but with their army of bots / possessed Lalafell, they could probably earn a steady income at whatever pricing scheme they chose to run with, whether it was super low to keep regular players away, or suddenly jacking things up, and then price dumping again if people came in).

It's definitely a very complicated issue / situation and I'd say at least in some ways, XIV has been much more friendly to players to bypass RMT controlled situations: An individual player can take the time to farm their own mats (or with the help of a friend or two) and craft their own gear (or get real players to do it, etc.).

With most valuable Max Level Drops being U/U right now, that also effectively cuts out RMT Corporations as well.

I'll be curious to see how this develops later.

They *can* but its just not very likely. FFXIV is just not very RMT friendly, nor farming friendly, so the chances of RMT's getting a control of the economy are effectively close to 0. Look at all the RMT's you've seen and do you notice any real effect on the economy? Nope. There's a reason for that. Its just not as effective, and not nearly as time-efficient as botting on other games. A monopoly team is basically a waste of resources (cuz you gotta pay them) since they aren't really needed. Add the team once it becomes a real problem, and since its not a problem right now at all then they can continue doing whatever it is they've been doing. The chances of any real rmt corporation taking a real interest in ffxiv are incredibly small, as there are many more games out there (particularly free ones, or highly popular p2p) where an RMT corp could make a LOT more money. FFXIV is a shitty game to do it in. If i was an RMT corp I wouldn't even bother at all. Much better options out there, which is why this game isn't overrun with RMT's. Course there will always be idiots that try to RMT everything, but for the most part XIV doesnt have to worry about it thanks to its design.

[Deltara]

I'm guessing the real RMT money for FFXIV is making PL ptys, leveling up all jobs in a few days of PLing and then selling the account.

[Babydoll]

How are they not hurting themselves when they are making less money? lol

Well..I am not greedy and not one of those people who feel like I deserve 10m for stuff...but umm...what usually happens is the smart people hold onto the items until the supply runs out then they try to slowly bring it back up. I don't like greedy people or pricing items ridiculously high either..but I do not like selling stuff thats worth like 5k for 200gil because a bunch of derps wanna sell it super low >_<

I prefer the AH where you can't see the price others have it up for..but you can see the sale history. Compromise!

[Relic]

I usually undercut the lowest item by 1 gil. Its a good way to get your item sold first without destroying the value of the product. The exception is when I know an item sells quick enough that I wont have to do that.

[Wolfie]

How are they not hurting themselves when they are making less money? lol

Well..I am not greedy and not one of those people who feel like I deserve 10m for stuff...but umm...what usually happens is the smart people hold onto the items until the supply runs out then they try to slowly bring it back up. I don't like greedy people or pricing items ridiculously high either..but I do not like selling stuff thats worth like 5k for 200gil because a bunch of derps wanna sell it super low >_<

I prefer the AH where you can't see the price others have it up for..but you can see the sale history. Compromise!

The people who undercut sell faster, sell more, and can use that money to invest in whatever sooner. You can hang on to your stuff and sell it in two weeks for 10 mil. But I've sold twice as much as you for 8 mil per week; who's the sucker now?

[Wobi]

Here's a good suggestion. If you are buying something and you are among the group of people who hate undercutters just buy the higher priced item that is more in line with what you believe to be the fair market value. However if you are buying up mats/gear and you purchase the bargain priced items you don't have a leg to stand on.

The way undercutting thrives is that people will buy at the lowest available price, then again why wouldn't they?

That being said I only undercut by maybe a few hundred gil unless I see obvious extortion pricing going on.

[Wolfie]

Here's a good suggestion. If you are buying something and you are among the group of people who hate undercutters just buy the higher priced item that is more in line with what you believe to be the fair market value.

LOL like that's ever going to happen.

The people who complain about undercutting have this ridiculous double standard where they expect to have the easiest and best solution every time. They're okay with buying the cheapest item because it's the first on the list and they save money, but they also want to never have to re-list their items, for their items to go fast, and to get more for them than their market value.

[Firon]

How are they not hurting themselves when they are making less money? lol

Well..I am not greedy and not one of those people who feel like I deserve 10m for stuff...but umm...what usually happens is the smart people hold onto the items until the supply runs out then they try to slowly bring it back up. I don't like greedy people or pricing items ridiculously high either..but I do not like selling stuff thats worth like 5k for 200gil because a bunch of derps wanna sell it super low >_<

I prefer the AH where you can't see the price others have it up for..but you can see the sale history. Compromise!

When you make a 100% profit you are not hurting your self. If i can sell 20 pairs of pants for 50k while your waiting to sell 5 for 100k i will always make more money.

The people who undercut sell faster, sell more, and can use that money to invest in whatever sooner. You can hang on to your stuff and sell it in two weeks for 10 mil. But I've sold twice as much as you for 8 mil per week; who's the sucker now?

This ^