Did they let the battle TL team fo the MSQ this time?

[0blivion]

Multiple instances of there being like three lines in JP, compared to one vastly different line in English. No, I don't care if the localization us simultaneously developed, it's clearly off the rails because FR/DE aren't even close to being this bad.

... It's infuriating because it makes talking about canon with others a lot harder. Usually it's just the battle localization that is this atrocious (hello Endsinger), but the main game? Really?

[Shistar]

Could you provide examples please? I had no idea Endsinger's localization was bad..?

[0blivion]

I'm too lazy to summarize it all, but have a gander at this thread:

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...r-The-Japanese

Basically, the English text of this game veers very heavily towards 'localization' and not 'translation' in a way that messes up a lot of shit. I usually choose Endsinger as the example because it's so, so silly. The time she reinvokes the death of the universe, the JP has her call her attack (as in, the English word!) Fatalism. The English localization? "This is fate!" I get the localizers think they know better, but they super don't.

Similarly, one of her Elenchos casts has this as its dialogue: "Utterly futile." - The JP is something along the lines of "This, too, is a form despair can take." Which. That sounds clunky, and I'd fix it if I was a localizer, but this girl talks about despair nonstop, yet the English TL purged it from several places???

Rubicante, a character whose personality is valuing fair and square fights (both in FFIV and FFXIV), sounds needlessly cocky in the English version. Here's a side-by-side by yours truly:

EN: "The archfiend of fire has no equal."
JP (unvoiced): 私は四天王が一人、火のルビカンテ。 - "I am one of the four archfiends*; Rubicante, [the archfiend] of fire."
JP (voiced): 正々堂々、戦おうぞ！- "Let's fight fair and square."

*Archfiend itself is a localization choice, but that was made back when FFIV first came out, so I'm not gonna bother with it.

Basically, nearly all of the battle dialogue in this game is absolute ass.

Then there's Wuk Lamat in the main story. She talks about smiles a lot, which has narrative ties to the song "Smile", but 90% of the instances were removed, making it incoherent as shit.

[RedLolly]

Now. See, to me these are really minor details. The idea is still there, and it doesn't mess up our understanding in the moment.

This is a case of what I know of, but the only instance of actual ass translation that messed up fights is "Larboard," a dead term for the port side of a ship. The Japanese version just said left.

Honestly the only localization decision that fundamentally hurt a character to me is Estinien uses a term for the WoL (aibou) that is very casual but affectionate term. He's SUPPOSED to refer to us like "partner," "buddy," or "pal" but it's instead always the unfortunately less intimate "friend." And he calls the WoL that all the time, alone and in front of others.

I don't expect Estinien to call the WoL his Bestie all the time, but he is *supposed* to, and it's a shame the translator didn't try to get us accustomed to any type of affectionate nickname or anything to get that detail of his character accross.

[Shistar]

Alright, took a look at the thread and your explanation, thank you.
I'm pretty sure she actually does say "Utterly futile", though? I feel like I remember that voice line. And about calling out her attack, Fatalism, I get it but it also sounds like yelling out power ranger moves in a fight that is, quite literally, deciding the fate of the universe... I think "This is fate!" gets the idea across (you can see she's casting Fatalism anyway) and it sounds more like she's talking to us instead of announcing her attacks like they need voice activation.

I'm also that little shit that enjoys the Larboard/Starboard nonsense. Yes, EN players would technically be at a disadvantage because they don't have the same amount of information at the start, but after you see it happen it's fairly easy to remember L(left) for Larboard and if it's not Larboard then it's right. But I also wouldn't be up in arms if they changed it, I just like it when the boss doesn't spoon feed me the solutions to their mechanics.
I agree with RedLolly, as long as we're not missing vital context, it really doesn't need to be word-for-word to me. You didn't miss anything with Rubicante's dialogue, you know he's an archfiend, the fire one, and I don't quite remember but I'm pretty sure you get told either before or very soon after that there's 4 of them.

If "bro" was an appropriate fantasy term to use instead of a modern one I'd expect Estinien to be calling us that lol I think pal would be cute, but maybe they decided against it because it goes a bit against his edgy persona? Even if he's not as brooding anymore, he strikes me as the kind of character that doesn't wanna look too soft.

[Mouthbone]

We should really stop trying to adapt the text to make it flow naturally in the target language and go back to translation notes

[0blivion]

Alright, took a look at the thread and your explanation, thank you.
I'm pretty sure she actually does say "Utterly futile", though? I feel like I remember that voice line. And about calling out her attack, Fatalism, I get it but it also sounds like yelling out power ranger moves in a fight that is, quite literally, deciding the fate of the universe... I think "This is fate!" gets the idea across (you can see she's casting Fatalism anyway) and it sounds more like she's talking to us instead of announcing her attacks like they need voice activation.

I'm also that little shit that enjoys the Larboard/Starboard nonsense. Yes, EN players would technically be at a disadvantage because they don't have the same amount of information at the start, but after you see it happen it's fairly easy to remember L(left) for Larboard and if it's not Larboard then it's right. But I also wouldn't be up in arms if they changed it, I just like it when the boss doesn't spoon feed me the solutions to their mechanics.
I agree with RedLolly, as long as we're not missing vital context, it really doesn't need to be word-for-word to me. You didn't miss anything with Rubicante's dialogue, you know he's an archfiend, the fire one, and I don't quite remember but I'm pretty sure you get told either before or very soon after that there's 4 of them.

If "bro" was an appropriate fantasy term to use instead of a modern one I'd expect Estinien to be calling us that lol I think pal would be cute, but maybe they decided against it because it goes a bit against his edgy persona? Even if he's not as brooding anymore, he strikes me as the kind of character that doesn't wanna look too soft.

I'm saying she doesn't say "Utterly futile" in the Japanese script. And I dunno how to tell you that there's a big difference between arrogance (i.e. Rubicante's "has no equal" in English) vs. humility and sportsmanship ("Let's fight fair and square"). Like it's a major characterization error, and it's inconsistent with both the JP and the original FFIV.

I do agree starboard and larboard is fine though, mostly because the other non-JP languages have to contend with it. It's not like I want a fully literal translation, I just want the battle dialogue to be even remotely related to what's going on in the original script.

[0blivion]

I swear to god, I just checked the German script and while I need this voice actress to get vocal coaching immediately, the Endsinger there actually does say "Fatalism!" like she's supposed to. Interestingly, the French doesn't seem to do that. So... my point still stays. Idk why the German TL team manages to get it right and the English one consistently seems to feel the need to add 'flourishes' that change the script for no reason.

[Connor]

Haven’t they been doing this since at least FFIV? Seems a bit late to change their minds now

[Underscore]

I swear to god, I just checked the German script and while I need this voice actress to get vocal coaching immediately, the Endsinger there actually does say "Fatalism!" like she's supposed to. Interestingly, the French doesn't seem to do that. So... my point still stays. Idk why the German TL team manages to get it right and the English one consistently seems to feel the need to add 'flourishes' that change the script for no reason.

They've done this with other bosses too. For King Thordan's big spectacle raidwide in Japanese you can hear him saying "Ultimate End", whereas the English text says "I shall end your vain struggle!". Even if the localizers thought him saying the name of his attack out loud is silly or whatever, they easily could've changed it to "This is your Ultimate End!" or something like that.

Same goes for Halone's big spectacle attack where she yells "AEGIS OF HALONE!" in katakana before going full ekusukariba on us. The English meanwhile has her flatly say "mine is the aegis!" instead.