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  1. #91
    Player
    MoonNoire's Avatar
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    Feb 2024
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    Dalmasca
    Posts
    71
    Character
    Remi Auclair
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by BokoToloko View Post
    Altering the flow of the story just to appeal the loud collective of armchair writers seems like a good way to kill the story altogether.
    The story has been dead since 7.0 and 7.3 has been CBU3 going "NONONONO" and sticking xiv with a defibrillator over and over, going by the teaser at the end of the patch's MSQ
    I don't think they need the community's help since they seem perfectly capable of killing their game on their own
    (6)

  2. #92
    Player
    BokoToloko's Avatar
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    Jan 2017
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    403
    Character
    Boko Toloko
    World
    Shiva
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by MoonNoire View Post
    The story has been dead since 7.0 and 7.3 has been CBU3 going "NONONONO" and sticking xiv with a defibrillator over and over, going by the teaser at the end of the patch's MSQ
    I don't think they need the community's help since they seem perfectly capable of killing their game on their own
    I've read enough "solutions" for the story from the "community" to know that, for a blessing, the story hasn't hit rock bottom and the "concerned players regarding the story" think way more highly of themselves than they should. But that's how it works in every community, everyone thinks they can do better (and, unsurprisingly enough, none of them has actually tried to write a story, let along one that holds against honest scrutiny) than the author. Here, it's just more of the same.

    People have always deified FFXIV storytelling when, at the very best, it's just nice but usually averages in the lukewarm territory. And, yet, armchair writers believe they can actually improve while posting god-awfully simplistic and poorly structured solutions.
    (6)
    Last edited by BokoToloko; 12-15-2025 at 11:13 PM.

  3. #93
    Player
    TBerry's Avatar
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    Dec 2020
    Posts
    562
    Character
    Sakura Ichijo
    World
    Omega
    Main Class
    Bard Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by BokoToloko View Post
    I've read enough "solutions" for the story from the "community" to know that, for a blessing, the story hasn't hit rock bottom and the "concerned players regarding the story" think way more highly of themselves than they should. But that's how it works in every community, everyone thinks they can do better (and, unsurprisingly enough, none of them has actually tried to write a story, let along one that holds against honest scrutiny) than the author. Here, it's just more of the same.

    People have always deified FFXIV storytelling when, at the very best, it's just nice but usually averages in the lukewarm territory. And, yet, armchair writers believe they can actually improve while posting god-awfully simplistic and poorly structured solutions.
    They're so used to be the main character it's become chronic.
    There is nothing wrong with being the hero in a story, but it's still fiction.
    (5)
    Last edited by TBerry; 12-16-2025 at 03:18 AM.
    Dawntrail is what I imagine the entire MSQ as a healer-main.

  4. #94
    Player
    Valence's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Posts
    4,910
    Character
    Sunie Dakwhil
    World
    Twintania
    Main Class
    Machinist Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by BokoToloko View Post
    I've read enough "solutions" for the story from the "community" to know that, for a blessing, the story hasn't hit rock bottom and the "concerned players regarding the story" think way more highly of themselves than they should. But that's how it works in every community, everyone thinks they can do better (and, unsurprisingly enough, none of them has actually tried to write a story, let along one that holds against honest scrutiny) than the author. Here, it's just more of the same.

    People have always deified FFXIV storytelling when, at the very best, it's just nice but usually averages in the lukewarm territory. And, yet, armchair writers believe they can actually improve while posting god-awfully simplistic and poorly structured solutions.
    There is a lot of assumptions here. Can't talk for everyone but I certainly won't pretend I can write a better story. It may be a past time of mine in tabletop and whatnot, but I'm not a professional writer. All I can do is give feedback on something I really didn't like, or point at what I consider to be dramatic flaws.
    I also never considered that getting rid of that one character would suddenly fix all the issues, since I consider them to be inherent to the writing choices and the target audience shift in the tone.
    I'm not here to give "solutions for the story". Not my job. Perhaps if you could actually point me at which solutions were offered that you refer to here it would actually help, because so far it only sounds like strawmaning?

    You can call people arrogant all your like, that doesn't make less so of an ad personam that doesn't even bring anything constructive.
    (15)

  5. #95
    Player
    BokoToloko's Avatar
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    Jan 2017
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    403
    Character
    Boko Toloko
    World
    Shiva
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Valence View Post
    There is a lot of assumptions here. Can't talk for everyone but I certainly won't pretend I can write a better story. It may be a past time of mine in tabletop and whatnot, but I'm not a professional writer. All I can do is give feedback on something I really didn't like, or point at what I consider to be dramatic flaws.
    I also never considered that getting rid of that one character would suddenly fix all the issues, since I consider them to be inherent to the writing choices and the target audience shift in the tone.
    I'm not here to give "solutions for the story". Not my job. Perhaps if you could actually point me at which solutions were offered that you refer to here it would actually help, because so far it only sounds like strawmaning?

    You can call people arrogant all your like, that doesn't make less so of an ad personam that doesn't even bring anything constructive.
    You assume I'm speaking about you specifically and not about the several posts in this and other threads that get their panties in a twist about one fictional character the "community" (aka the loudest criers) turned into a scapegoat because the expansion story wasn't up to their standards. Wouldn't be calling them "armchair writers" if they didn't literally tried to pilot the story themselves (and this thread has enough proof of that).

    Trying to list fallacies from the list doesn't make them exist out of thin air (not to mention that's, on itself, a fallacy). And just becuase it's feedback doesn't mean it's uncontestable or infallible. Feedback can be flawed and can be contested. And that would be assuming throwing the umpteenth tantrum about Wuk Lamat has any actual constructive criticism on it, which is a considerable stretch. Letting the noisiest complainers lead the stage totally unopposed is, by far and large, more destructive than "calling names".

    But if you want it nice and simple, there you go, for everyone: Stop trying to pilot the story. It's already messy when it changes hands, even more when it comes from an outsider (a.k.a. the reader).
    (1)

  6. #96
    Player
    MoonNoire's Avatar
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    Feb 2024
    Location
    Dalmasca
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    71
    Character
    Remi Auclair
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by BokoToloko View Post
    But if you want it nice and simple, there you go, for everyone: Stop trying to pilot the story. It's already messy when it changes hands, even more when it comes from an outsider (a.k.a. the reader).
    I don't believe anyone made you the authority on what people are or aren't allowed to do or criticize, but I could've missed the meeting
    (10)

  7. #97
    Player
    localareanetwork's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2021
    Location
    Forgotten Springs
    Posts
    263
    Character
    Local-area Network
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Samurai Lv 100
    DT Turned me into a cutscene skipper. I have literally no idea what's going on in the post game
    (5)

  8. #98
    Player
    Luca_'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2022
    Posts
    73
    Character
    Luca Vares
    World
    Leviathan
    Main Class
    Gunbreaker Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by UNDEAD10000 View Post
    Making wuk Lamat as a main character while making our own character as a side character was biggest mistake they ever made that simply destroying entire story of Dawntrail and i simply hope we will never see Wuk Lamat again after Dawntrail.
    I don't even care that the WoL took a backseat but doing that so that we could have 20 hours of Wuk Lamat talking over every other character in the MSQ was completely insane

    Offscreening Krile's most important reveal so we could spend more time with Wuk and then having her whine about how bored she was in Living Memory when we actually were focused on another character for 3 quests was some truly incredible writing
    (7)

  9. #99
    Player
    Astronis's Avatar
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    Mar 2024
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    446
    Character
    Astronis Smythe
    World
    Mateus
    Main Class
    Dark Knight Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by MoonNoire View Post
    The story has been dead since 7.0 and 7.3 has been CBU3 going "NONONONO" and sticking xiv with a defibrillator over and over, going by the teaser at the end of the patch's MSQ
    I don't think they need the community's help since they seem perfectly capable of killing their game on their own
    7.1-7.3 have been CBU3 setting up the next expac. Like they always do. For crying out loud, there was plenty wrong with Dawntrail, but it categorically did NOT kill the story and then leave the writers scrambling for a way to fix it. Dawntrail had plothooks for future events dangling about thick as a fleet of crowded fishing boats and everything in the post-patches has been picking up on those to follow up on.

    What the post-patches have done is demonstrate that the devs heard LOUD and CLEAR about how we (generally) feel about certain aspects of the story and they adjusted as much as is reasonable within the confines of stories that were already written by the time they caught all of our blowback. If they still want to tells stories about the WoL stepping back a bit and making sure there are more shoulders around than just his to bear the weight of the world, they know now that making us 'Speak to Wuk Lamat' isn't the way to tell it.
    (3)

  10. #100
    Player
    ZephyrMenodora's Avatar
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    Oct 2014
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    2,378
    Character
    Zephyr Menodora
    World
    Zalera
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 100
    Was amused during the game awards where FFXIV was represented by Wuk Lamat saying something lame and then they lost the award they were nominated for.
    (2)

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