Difficult experience in Forked Tower – a reminder to respect public content

[Watai]

You got to love how welcoming this community is, first time i try to get into Forked Tower and from the start i get singled out with an emote which as i learned later was not for "coordination" but to mark ma as a "Do not revive" player.
My first message asking for a revive was when ~10 ppl were on the ground, all of them got revived but not me.
As for the second message concerning the toxicity, it was sent after everyone else took the teleport to the next area making impossible to revive me since i assume you can't teleport back.
Then i get accused of "sniping" someone during the pride month.. Why bring up the pride month other than play the victim when you are not ?
Thanks to this post i learned what "sniper" meant in FFXIV, so let me get this straight, we all pay for the game (subscription and all), we farm in Occult Crescent to reach lvl 20 and access the raid, but somehow you have to be in a certain Discord to have a right to play without being griefed ?
No matter how you look at it, not reveving someone in this raid is griefing since you make them lose 30k exp and a level, this kind of behaviour is against ToS so how can some people still defend it ?

[Jeeqbit]

Always amusing when a single anecdote is used to "prove" a hypothesis.

That was the case for OP also.

The issue that is being overlooked is: why is it that so many people have negative opinions regarding 14-related Discords?

It's not the discords they have a negative opinion of. It is raiders in general they have a negative opinion of, whom they incorrectly assume are "elitist" and "exclusionary".

I truly get what it's like when you've never raided before - you think that raiders are some elite bunch trying to exclude you. But then you overcome the anxiety and join a party. You go through hours, days or weeks to get that clear. Then you don't want to go through that progression again, so you make a [Duty Complete] party. Suddenly, you have become the "excludes people" bunch. But once you get that far, you realize there is no other way; you can't go through all that prog every time just to reclear.

But the game is actually so large and cross-world now, that first timers can often find a full party of people new to the content. So it works out anyway, and everyone is happy, except those who haven't overcome that anxiety to try joining a High-End PF or discord.

So yes, a lot of people will naturally think these discords are some scary elite bunch. If they garner the courage to join a run their opinion will quickly transform.

[Mawlzy]

That was the case for OP also.
It's not the discords they have a negative opinion of. It is raiders in general they have a negative opinion of, whom they incorrectly assume are "elitist" and "exclusionary".

I truly get what it's like when you've never raided before - you think that raiders are some elite bunch trying to exclude you. But then you overcome the anxiety and join a party. You go through hours, days or weeks to get that clear. Then you don't want to go through that progression again, so you make a [Duty Complete] party. Suddenly, you have become the "excludes people" bunch. But once you get that far, you realize there is no other way; you can't go through all that prog every time just to reclear.

But the game is actually so large and cross-world now, that first timers can often find a full party of people new to the content. So it works out anyway, and everyone is happy, except those who haven't overcome that anxiety to try joining a High-End PF or discord.

So yes, a lot of people will naturally think these discords are some scary elite bunch. If they garner the courage to join a run their opinion will quickly transform.

Let's quit this "courage" nonsense, Jeeqbit, you're better than that. This is a video game, not the Marines. And anxiety is irrelevant to people who are trying to do this content, but are impeded first by the dreadful decisions of SE, compounded by the hostility expressed by some Discord groups.

As to "everyone is happy"... Honestly, mate, I think we'd get on IRL, but this Panglossian worldview directed at such an obviously flawed game is a little excessive.

Again, I understand there are helpful Discords out there. Indeed, when I started taking PvP seriously, I received a lot of help from a Discord server! It was from a general Discord hosted by a streamer. I went there when a handful of PvP Discords proved completely bloody useless, not to mention unpleasant.

If Discord servers wish to have a better reputation, I'd suggest they need to clean up their own houses. If they dislike Plebs vs Patricians mud-slinging, maybe they should reel in their members?

[BigCheez]

You got to love how welcoming this community is, first time i try to get into Forked Tower and from the start i get singled out with an emote which as i learned later was not for "coordination" but to mark ma as a "Do not revive" player.
My first message asking for a revive was when ~10 ppl were on the ground, all of them got revived but not me.
As for the second message concerning the toxicity, it was sent after everyone else took the teleport to the next area making impossible to revive me since i assume you can't teleport back.
Then i get accused of "sniping" someone during the pride month.. Why bring up the pride month other than play the victim when you are not ?
Thanks to this post i learned what "sniper" meant in FFXIV, so let me get this straight, we all pay for the game (subscription and all), we farm in Occult Crescent to reach lvl 20 and access the raid, but somehow you have to be in a certain Discord to have a right to play without being griefed ?
No matter how you look at it, not reveving someone in this raid is griefing since you make them lose 30k exp and a level, this kind of behaviour is against ToS so how can some people still defend it ?

And you can't just join a Discord to run the content like everyone else because... ?

[Astronis]

No matter how you look at it, not reveving someone in this raid is griefing since you make them lose 30k exp and a level, this kind of behaviour is against ToS so how can some people still defend it ?

I hope you reported them for that, it's blatantly against TOS.

[Kaurhz]

Same thing happened in BA,

and it's funny because it still happens in BA... Even when you aren't taking a portal away from anyone else.

Yet the developers in their infinite wisdom, and 6 years of experience since then thought... "That's a brilliant idea, let's do it again..., but this time make it worse".

[Watai]

I hope you reported them for that, it's blatantly against TOS.

Yes, only those from the chat, other players were not reported as they didn't express any hostility towards the "snipers"(which paid tickets to enter like everyone else. I only used 1 ticket to enter btw).

And you can't just join a Discord to run the content like everyone else because... ?

Why ? from what i see on this post, there are less Discord "elite" than regular players who just want to do the content they've worked toward unlocking. Also never received any Discord link when i was waiting for the Raid to open, or once i was in.

[Kaurhz]

And you can't just join a Discord to run the content like everyone else because... ?

To be honest,

They really shouldn't be putting content like this in a public space in the first place, because you'll always have those that are just genuinely not as clued in as others as to how certain communities function, or why they function for that matter, so in a good chunk of instances people are ascribing malice when there is actually none going on.

Have had this happen a couple of times when helping friends progress.

Like, this should have been a separate duty just how Delubrum was a separate duty... Not sure what insanity was going on, but this is entirely on the devs tbh.

[Novarius]

From my own personal experience, I have found collaborating with Discords running Forked Tower content a very pleasant experience overall. I’ve mainly stuck to Savage and Ultimate statics before and not really engaged with the BA/DRS discords, but I’m glad I did it’s made the process of organising getting into the content much simpler…

With regards to randoms who “snipe” a spot I sympathise with your situation, most of you are not doing this maliciously but you stowing away on an organised run potentially has several negative consequences:

1) You take the place of a team member who was on a vital Phantom Job (particularly if the team was running 1 Berserker or Oracle) which may mean the run is unwinnable unless people can flex or there are backups of that job.

2) You unintentionally prog lie by joining a run where they have progged far beyond you prog point, you had no way of knowing but essentially as one person can wipe the whole raid from doing some mechanics incorrectly you could be a ticking time bomb waiting to go off if you don’t know the mechanics and how to deal with them. I’m a seasoned veteran when it comes to high-end content and even I wouldn’t be ballsy enough to gatecrash a raid that is this punishing and requires intense co-ordination especially if I was fresh to the content/progging from the start.

It must feel awful to be left on the floor, but you can’t necessarily blame the 47 people, if you don’t know the content they could be shouldering an unnecessary burden of risk if they rez you and keep you in the mix, so I understand the reasoning behind it… if you should be angry at anyone it should be SE, they’re the reason that this content has created such a community divide and hostility.

[Neclord]

You got to love how welcoming this community is, first time i try to get into Forked Tower and from the start i get singled out with an emote which as i learned later was not for "coordination" but to mark ma as a "Do not revive" player.
My first message asking for a revive was when ~10 ppl were on the ground, all of them got revived but not me.
As for the second message concerning the toxicity, it was sent after everyone else took the teleport to the next area making impossible to revive me since i assume you can't teleport back.
Then i get accused of "sniping" someone during the pride month.. Why bring up the pride month other than play the victim when you are not ?
Thanks to this post i learned what "sniper" meant in FFXIV, so let me get this straight, we all pay for the game (subscription and all), we farm in Occult Crescent to reach lvl 20 and access the raid, but somehow you have to be in a certain Discord to have a right to play without being griefed ?
No matter how you look at it, not reveving someone in this raid is griefing since you make them lose 30k exp and a level, this kind of behaviour is against ToS so how can some people still defend it ?

For full context, OP and this person are now targeting organised runs in a group of 5 (increasing the likelihood fivefold that shotcallers and organisers lose out on a spot - which yes, completely dooms the run).