Prog skipping/lying is going wild this tier.

[AvoSturmfaust]

SE has made it abundantly clear that they won't enforce their own rules, so people have stopped caring.

It really isnt, i stated more then once that the dmg from someone is not good at all and he isnt carrying his own weight etc etc etc never happen anything, square doesnt really care about it after all its less money for them if they ban someone

[Immut]

A blacklist is a blacklist. You can call it whatever kind of list you want, but here's how a "community" blacklist would work:

1. Someone would be in charge of it.
2. That person would form their own clique at the top to manage it
3. One of them will do something inappropriate with a minor
4. Anyone who speaks out about it will end up on the blacklist.

Or some similar drama. The end result being the blacklist just results in a powerful clique that tries to give themselves the authority to pick and choose who gets to play the game based on increasingly petty until the toxicity reaches its peak and the entire thing implodes. This community has a hard time keeping a hunt linkshell open for more than 2 weeks without blowing up, you really want to trust anyone else to tell you who's toxic and who's not?

[Volgia]

Third party website =/= using a third party program. So you can't use that for evidence regardless.

Honestly, that website was going to be made sooner than later. At least we don't have a public blacklist like JP. Frankly, I'm surprised we don't have one considering how NA loves drama, so that seems perfect.

I don't mind the passport system but I'm surprised no one made a sting about it!

[AshtonCrowe]

Its unhinged to hop from PF to PF far above the progpoint to single handedly ruin the party within 2 pulls after already waiting for a while to fill.
All this wouldnt be a problem if SE stops actively protecting those players.
Players that are not bad at the game want to be able to point out if someone is holding the group back but we cant because everything you say in partychat nowadays can get you into the GM-Jail. We want to be able to look up playerstats on certain websites before we decide to keep that person in the party but even that is... against the guidelines. The only way to escape from players like this is to just disband the party and open a new one where the circle begins again.

I don't think chat should be moderated unless it's Sexual in nature, Game is rated T for Teen. Average Teenager in the modern era has access to way worse stuff than we did in the PS2 Era. If you can't handle being called out you shouldn't play the hardest content in an MMORPG. At the same time, SE shouldn't lock cool looking stuff behind raids. Make the cosmetic craftable for an insane cost like 99 Darksteel HQ Nuggets + 50 Current expansion HQ Leather + 50 Current Expansion Desynthesis only juice + 60 Demimateria 3 & some high tier materia from current expansion for good measure.

Give raiders engraved gear (The weapon has raid name somewhere on it) and give everyone else the standard version, This satisifes both parties and keeps the average user out of raids. I want to raid but do not have a static, And know i won't be quiet in chat cause i'm from the OG CoD era so i'd be getting banned by playing with publics & I don't trust the average FC in this game after all the nonsense drama i've gotten pulled into over the years. If you aren't 24/7 happy go lucky you get tunnel visioned for stupidity.

I wouldn't want to attempt that level of difficulty with the average user who still after all this time can't figure out Aurum Vale mechanics, Or wipe repeatedly to the Ascian Prime fight despite braindead easy "Get far away from partner to break chain" mechanic.

SE Actively makes toxicity by forcing you to do High End for the coolest stuff in-game, Give people the cosmetic. If you want the cool glowing raid name on it? Then it's time to GIT GUD, But otherwise the cosmetic alone would satisfy most people.

That or start making normal weapons look cool instead of A.I Recolors, Almost everything in Dawntrail looks like hot garbage weapon wise, Was the same for Endwalker.

[Luca_]

A blacklist is a blacklist. You can call it whatever kind of list you want, but here's how a "community" blacklist would work:

1. Someone would be in charge of it.
2. That person would form their own clique at the top to manage it
3. One of them will do something inappropriate with a minor
4. Anyone who speaks out about it will end up on the blacklist.

Or some similar drama. The end result being the blacklist just results in a powerful clique that tries to give themselves the authority to pick and choose who gets to play the game based on increasingly petty until the toxicity reaches its peak and the entire thing implodes. This community has a hard time keeping a hunt linkshell open for more than 2 weeks without blowing up, you really want to trust anyone else to tell you who's toxic and who's not?

Exactly this. Public blacklists aren't actually anything new and they always just devolve into a tool to bully people.

There's also a 0% chance SE wouldn't start throwing down very harsh bans within 24 hours if people start sharing a public name-and-shame list in PF. Bullying other players is like... literally the only thing FFXIV moderation cares about. It's THE cardinal sin here. I promise you they don't care if you tell them "b-but we have 4 witnesses saying they griefed!", it's completely out of touch to suggest that somehow makes it ToS compliant.

[UkcsAlias]

What SE could do is making it possible in PF to set a health/progress treshold that must have been reached before. While not failproof, it does at least prevent fresh players from joining an enrage party:
To make them consistent, we both use the same scaling 0% is fresh, 100% is clear/enrage:
- The health is marked using: Min boss damage dealt. Going from 100 to 0. Note that 100 does include 99.5%. Multistage fights include the stage here. (for example for ex3 you could do 0% phase 2, while the chaotic only uses health)
- For progress its simply the time passed compared tot the enrage timer, having each stage maximized in time (So if you get the transition in ex3 directly after ice, it can jump 10% instantly, which means there is always only a stage 1 percentage available if you never reached stage 2, even if effectively you survived longer)

And yes, the idea is you can mix these! (100% enrage, 80% damage means 20% enrage hp remaining)

It sadly is not going to prevent cases in which you for example set it to 10%, and someone that was hard carried to that joins in. But it does filter out quite a bit. And even here a few things can be done to assist:

- As party leader, your 10th best result is considered instead of just your best, for enabling you to set this as requirement. Or some other metric is used to exclude outliers and force leaders to set it more realistic to what they reliably should be able to reach. For joiners this check is ignored. And once cleared (even if once) these restrictions also drop.
- Time is included as a factor. Reaching 50% 4 weeks ago has less meaning, so it does consider lower. I would say it just drops the percentage value that is accepted by 10% for every week beyond the first. Yes, holidays of 2 weeks can mean you will have to reprog from 80% even if you saw enrage.

But yeah, i can imagine this being too much work and exclude people too often... but tbh, those people should in those cases make a pf themselve. And if they dont or refuse, thats their problem. If you are not even willing to take this effort, you are also not willing enough to clear it. (that you dont need it most of the time is something else. and if you dont know how it works, thats a learning moment)

[YukioKobayashi]

What SE could do is making it possible in PF to set a health/progress treshold that must have been reached before. While not failproof, it does at least prevent fresh players from joining an enrage party:
To make them consistent, we both use the same scaling 0% is fresh, 100% is clear/enrage:
- The health is marked using: Min boss damage dealt. Going from 100 to 0. Note that 100 does include 99.5%. Multistage fights include the stage here. (for example for ex3 you could do 0% phase 2, while the chaotic only uses health)
- For progress its simply the time passed compared tot the enrage timer, having each stage maximized in time (So if you get the transition in ex3 directly after ice, it can jump 10% instantly, which means there is always only a stage 1 percentage available if you never reached stage 2, even if effectively you survived longer) ... )

This would be 100% a step in the right direction.
SE likes to implemented things that are otherwise only available via thrid party- programs or websites. (Auto-Waymarker, Raidplaner ect.)
Giving us a ToS conform "passport website" feature In-Game would only hurt prog skippers and doesnt affect honest players. At least not negatively.

[dspguy]

This problem is inherent to a game like this. The moment that they added "Duty Complete" flags to PF, it was only natural for people to start lying. I'm not saying it is right. The way I see it, they give players tools to easily make parties. They make it so the only thing you risk when you run something with possible "prog liars" is time. You risk minimal amounts of gil (food, pots, repairs). You risk no experience. You don't risk having to fight other enemies to get a token to "spawn" your target. It isn't like if you wipe, you lost a day or week of progress and need to farm pop items and experience again.

In other words, the risk is minimal. I think you just got to take the good with the bad.

[Jeeqbit]

The moment that they added "Duty Complete" flags to PF, it was only natural for people to start lying.

No, they did it before that flag existed. I know because I made parties back then for Alexander in Heavensward. Once I was consistent at it, I made A10S post-Steamroller parties and none of the people joining were beyond that prog wall.

It was also back then even that I regularly observed parties getting to a mechanic in a messy way and then saying they were "up" to it and modifying their PF, which they still do to this day. There is just a fundamental misunderstanding of what being "up" to a mechanic means. There are many players that actually think seeing a mechanic with lots of deaths and damage downs and a healer LB3 means they are "up" to the mechanic.

Back then, instead of [Duty Complete], we put "2 chests, no bonus" to scare away people that didn't have it on farm and this was actually fine in my experience. Usually, these parties went smooth as they do now. I never even had to consider kicking anyone in reclears. But that terminology looks very toxic, so [Duty Complete] was a way to make PF look more inviting to a new player.

[Nadda]

kind of an odd place to put this question but like... what tag do you use for like almost got it area of prog?

Because I know it's not duty complete.

But I figured duty completion be like the - I've seen most the fight just need to clean it up and kill it level.

Because practice doesn't seem to be the right tag.

(I never had to make my own groups before)