Why do casual players seem entitled to cosmetic items added in game?

[Lilapop]

snip

Pretending every instance of "player versus player" conflict is a response of player vs company is delusional. A vast majority? sure. The overall community however is far from perfect.

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

Did they ever mentioned about the content being unsync-able in the future or is this forever locked to lv100?

[Collin_Sky]

Oh brother, I can't believe there actually was someone in this thread saying that using in game macros to craft is cheating.

Good grief.

[Gurgeh]

...
We are all playing Don Quijote here.

Does that use a sub model or F2P? (I've got no time for Gatcha and fomo)
;-)

[GTK0HLK]

No the success of the game rests entirely on people like me that supported the game back in the 1.x days. That offered feedback, support, and loyalty to show that a rebuild would be successful.

All you casuals do is get carried by me through your normal content. I can personally guatentee that I've put more money into this game than you have.

Have a seat. I'm the target audience at the moment. I'll help you not take 30 minutes to clear the latest dungeon right after I clear the latest savage-level content Square has released for me.

See? Pretty easy to sound like a cringy badass, huh? But something tells me you weren't pretending or using hyperbole. That you actually believe the us vs them is player vs player and not player vs company.

With Complete and intentional Disrespect.

The point in which people have to continually care that you are here before the fall.

Is already past.

I know full well other 1.0 users do not care that much to name drop it.

and those users simply put would rather it not be tarnished or used to put down others.
you make them all look bad.

Just like every past item should return without Replica being attached to it. [Examples: White Ravens]

[People won't see the replica anyways if things get turned into sets like outfits for jewelry and etc.]

You clearly do not represent A Majority, let alone the entire minority you're name dropping in.

[LibitIncarne]

Scaling doesn't really fix the body checks. All the stuff you listed I believe has very few mechs that are body checks. This fight has one that I heard about that is pretty major and it's the towers in P2. They would also have to lower the number of players required for the checks along with scaling Cloud of darkness hp.

The Dalriada has a few towers, missing them doesn't wipe you if you're undersized because of the Echo boost you get.
And speaking of body checks, has anyone actually tried doing this undersized yet?

[Gurgeh]

ok at the past in the game to see what'll happen in future. SE are very predictable like this.. If you hate crafting and hate Exploratory even, then you can still make Gil through combat, go farm materia, don't unload it on the market instantly, understand that with each patch of crafted gear for battle you need materia, sell the materia, heck you can buy it cheap and then merchant it.

What? I don't understand this? You can't even build extract enough Materia for your own needs? Let alone have enough to sell for a set of crafted in time for raid.
Besides, I've no idea how much materia is needed to penta meld. Its random. Its impossible to work out including margins for 'sample' size with all the percentages. So you just have to save it until after your done with it. So thats not an option for gil to prep for raid, until after I'm raid ready myself. I don't understand gearing, but I know there is more than one set per expansion so thats 2 x 10 x how many sets? 5 x how many x how many sets? (nah just got to save it.) Selling materia for gil (- commision) and then buying it back including commission, is just going to be a loss. If I'm bad at economics and trading, I don't much care, and kowing Im bad isn't goign to suddenly make me better.

Understand what people need and when they need it..

I've got no talent for that. No idea how to find out. No interest in finding out. Politics and economics and sociology, and reasearcing redit 'into a game' on the internet doesn't interest me. Spreadsheets bore me. And I don't enjoy squeezing profit. If I see someone flogging NPC gear for sprouts above the NPC price, I just go buy something to undercut it.
I have a system for selling stuff on the MB *quickly*. I check my retainers when I remember and am waiting to queue. 2/3 times a week. (sometimes I do inventory management, sometimes retainers, sometimes gold saucer for mini cactpot and and to sell my cards. Never all of them everyday. Thank god our inventories arent bigger. Just a shame they are full of so many psuedo currencies. I just have to throw most of the untradeable stuff away, no idea whats its for. Mostly when I used to look it up it buys old gear. If I don't know what it is and when I got it or where to use it or on what, it gets discarded. The item hint descriptions seem to have no purpose.

Even crafters, prior to patch, go fill yourself with a nice stack of Heliometry tomestones, 7.2 drops, and you suddenly have a highly valued currency. Use it to sell those items,

What?!! I only get 450 a week. It takes me two weeks just to buy one chest piece?
I was capping out every week I could once I finished MSQ, unsubbed for about six weeks only, then capped every week, and I only just finished getting my main job to 720 about two weeks ago??!!
How am i supposed to have helios to spare?
Besides I don't think this currency was even out until savage already hit.

or use those tomes as bartering, people do "Your tomes, my mats -> Your gear"

???? You cant trade tome gear? What mats?

all the time on party finder, and it's very lucrative for crafters to do that.. They make some Gil, they spend absolutely nothing on Tomes, and you get a significant discount.

Honestly this made no sense to me. Its like its in a foreign language. It clearly requires other knowledge and concepts I've not come accross. How do I make money off crafters with tome gear I cant trade when I dont have enough tomes myself?

Heck, you can do this on patch day and include hunts in the process.. Sell your items, then go do hunt trains for a few cycles, and suddenly before you know it by the late afternoon / early evening you will have easily capped your tomes a couple of times and will easily have been 2-8M Gil

No I did a hunt train once and while it was fun being on voice with someone, the hunt itself was so boring. I'll do them if they can invent someway to get the marks to scale in diffculty. Besides, when ever a bunch of people suddenly show up at an aetherite and you find out a hunt is happening, I'm already doing something. And they never stop to talk or wait around. zip in and zip out.
Perhaps also because I still don't understand. How does a hunt train earn you gil? Whats it got to do with patch day? It just for gems to buy glams and thing? Some materials yes, but... I 've got no idea what to buy. I tried selling mats from Fats in DT whith spare gems. I gotta say, I didn't earn me much.


Nope, I'm not spending a 'whole' evening chasing after after groups spamming a to one hit kill stuff. I just don't get how people find that 'fun'? Besides it seemed kind of drama ridden, there was arguing about when people should go and when people should wait.

or only an evening amount of work,

X-D No. I'm not doing 'anything' that feels like work. Certainly not a whole afternoon. I'll do 15 minutes tedium once a week, if I can mix it up with other types of tedium on other days. Like how I do inventory one day, retainers another, cactpot and cards another.

and no it isn't hyperbole like the "Go make millions an hour" comment by doing Bunnies in Pagos/Pyros/Hydatos (They are lucrative, but not that lucrative), or you then have more to barter with people.

I remember those. They weren't fun to do even when did Eureka before DT. There is no challlenge. Its all press A one hit killing. More or less. How can anyone do that for fun. I just don't get it.
Bartering? You cant barter on the MB. You put someting up. 15 minutes later someone has undercut you. And if its really valuable it probably hasn't sold two days later. YOu keep lowering the price, and eventually yes it does sell, but not quickly so you lose a huge amount of value if your not checking prices constantly as far as I can tell. Now I just set price to all zeros with at most three significant figures. If its 100,000 I just knock 10,000 off at a a time or it never sells before someone else hits the market.

It isn't that you're playing the game wrong, but you're playing it in a very restrictive manner.

I just don't enjoy what some other people enjoy. I have pretty low boredom threshold. And am acutely aware of if something is neither 'interesting' nor 'fun'. (I will never finish ARR relics)

I'm not restricing myself. I just only enjoy battle content and helping people. That's what I enjoy. I do this for fun. If its not fun I stop logging in. (and at present I'm unsubbed for the second time in 3 months after four years straight every day.) So you wont have to hear from me in 7/14 days.

I want to do battle content. Or aim for a 'very clear guaranteed' goal, that is a progression to something. Bartering (arguing, cajoling, persuading, negotiating, profiteering) speculating, "gambling", doesn't interest me, its too vague and uncertain, and I think I'd be bad at it anyway.
I get the market board, but truth is I mostly sell stuff and never buy. I don't see what is has that I need. About the only time I use it is for a glam competition, or to buy a present for someone. Thats the only time I buy anything. I've no idea how any of my stuff sells to be honest. What are people doing with it all? Its junk. Crafting something I guess. But who are they selling it to unless its glamour? I guess thats what it all is.

I enjoyed battling in this game for four years. I never used to have to do this tedious stuff back then. The casual game used to be way more challenging than it is now (old Aurum, learning Darkness alliance, some of the trials and dungeons back when I had no experience, many of the alliances after.) The game has got easier, I've got better, and now I have to do all this... mindless mash 'a' stuff and crafting in order to keep battling. (When I suspect I'm porbbaly just going to be no good at savage anyway.) I wanted to tray savage out when it was the 'current' thing. And I missed the boat. I didn't even know the name of the boat it seems.

[LibitIncarne]

(SNIP)
1: What?
2: I've
3: What?!!
4: ????
5: Honestly
7: X-D
8: I
9: I

1: Do hunt trains
2: Skill Issue
3: By being subbed and doing content for long enough, or by supplementing that gear you have with drops from Alliance Raids.
4: The five materials used in crafted gear and the material used in creating current endgame potions all cost 20 Allagan Tomestones of Aesthetics.
5: If you don't have enough tomes, that's a skill issue. Grind more.
6: You're just showing that you want people to bend to your whims here instead of looking at what's actually going on or joining the community to go look at when trains are being scheduled.
7: "I want lots of money without putting in any effort!"
8: "This is too easy, it's boring so I don't want to do it."
Pick one of the two stances to have.
9: You should probably play a more appealing game if this is your stance.

[Kaurhz]

What? I don't understand this? You can't even build extract enough Materia for your own needs? Let alone have enough to sell for a set of crafted in time for raid.
Besides, I've no idea how much materia is needed to penta meld. Its random. Its impossible to work out including margins for 'sample' size with all the percentages. So you just have to save it until after your done with it. So thats not an option for gil to prep for raid, until after I'm raid ready myself. I don't understand gearing, but I know there is more than one set per expansion so thats 2 x 10 x how many sets? 5 x how many x how many sets? (nah just got to save it.) Selling materia for gil (- commision) and then buying it back including commission, is just going to be a loss. If I'm bad at economics and trading, I don't much care, and kowing Im bad isn't goign to suddenly make me better.


I've got no talent for that. No idea how to find out. No interest in finding out. Politics and economics and sociology, and reasearcing redit 'into a game' on the internet doesn't interest me. Spreadsheets bore me. And I don't enjoy squeezing profit. If I see someone flogging NPC gear for sprouts above the NPC price, I just go buy something to undercut it.
I have a system for selling stuff on the MB *quickly*. I check my retainers when I remember and am waiting to queue. 2/3 times a week. (sometimes I do inventory management, sometimes retainers, sometimes gold saucer for mini cactpot and and to sell my cards. Never all of them everyday. Thank god our inventories arent bigger. Just a shame they are full of so many psuedo currencies. I just have to throw most of the untradeable stuff away, no idea whats its for. Mostly when I used to look it up it buys old gear. If I don't know what it is and when I got it or where to use it or on what, it gets discarded. The item hint descriptions seem to have no purpose.


What?!! I only get 450 a week. It takes me two weeks just to buy one chest piece?
I was capping out every week I could once I finished MSQ, unsubbed for about six weeks only, then capped every week, and I only just finished getting my main job to 720 about two weeks ago??!!
How am i supposed to have helios to spare?
Besides I don't think this currency was even out until savage already hit.


???? You cant trade tome gear? What mats?


Honestly this made no sense to me. Its like its in a foreign language. It clearly requires other knowledge and concepts I've not come accross. How do I make money off crafters with tome gear I cant trade when I dont have enough tomes myself?


No I did a hunt train once and while it was fun being on voice with someone, the hunt itself was so boring. I'll do them if they can invent someway to get the marks to scale in diffculty. Besides, when ever a bunch of people suddenly show up at an aetherite and you find out a hunt is happening, I'm already doing something. And they never stop to talk or wait around. zip in and zip out.
Perhaps also because I still don't understand. How does a hunt train earn you gil? Whats it got to do with patch day? It just for gems to buy glams and thing? Some materials yes, but... I 've got no idea what to buy. I tried selling mats from Fats in DT whith spare gems. I gotta say, I didn't earn me much.


Nope, I'm not spending a 'whole' evening chasing after after groups spamming a to one hit kill stuff. I just don't get how people find that 'fun'? Besides it seemed kind of drama ridden, there was arguing about when people should go and when people should wait.



X-D No. I'm not doing 'anything' that feels like work. Certainly not a whole afternoon. I'll do 15 minutes tedium once a week, if I can mix it up with other types of tedium on other days. Like how I do inventory one day, retainers another, cactpot and cards another.


I remember those. They weren't fun to do even when did Eureka before DT. There is no challlenge. Its all press A one hit killing. More or less. How can anyone do that for fun. I just don't get it.
Bartering? You cant barter on the MB. You put someting up. 15 minutes later someone has undercut you. And if its really valuable it probably hasn't sold two days later. YOu keep lowering the price, and eventually yes it does sell, but not quickly so you lose a huge amount of value if your not checking prices constantly as far as I can tell. Now I just set price to all zeros with at most three significant figures. If its 100,000 I just knock 10,000 off at a a time or it never sells before someone else hits the market.


I just don't enjoy what some other people enjoy. I have pretty low boredom threshold. And am acutely aware of if something is neither 'interesting' nor 'fun'. (I will never finish ARR relics)

I'm not restricing myself. I just only enjoy battle content and helping people. That's what I enjoy. I do this for fun. If its not fun I stop logging in. (and at present I'm unsubbed for the second time in 3 months after four years straight every day.) So you wont have to hear from me in 7/14 days.

I want to do battle content. Or aim for a 'very clear guaranteed' goal, that is a progression to something. Bartering (arguing, cajoling, persuading, negotiating, profiteering) speculating, "gambling", doesn't interest me, its too vague and uncertain, and I think I'd be bad at it anyway.
I get the market board, but truth is I mostly sell stuff and never buy. I don't see what is has that I need. About the only time I use it is for a glam competition, or to buy a present for someone. Thats the only time I buy anything. I've no idea how any of my stuff sells to be honest. What are people doing with it all? Its junk. Crafting something I guess. But who are they selling it to unless its glamour? I guess thats what it all is.

I enjoyed battling in this game for four years. I never used to have to do this tedious stuff back then. The casual game used to be way more challenging than it is now (old Aurum, learning Darkness alliance, some of the trials and dungeons back when I had no experience, many of the alliances after.) The game has got easier, I've got better, and now I have to do all this... mindless mash 'a' stuff and crafting in order to keep battling. (When I suspect I'm porbbaly just going to be no good at savage anyway.) I wanted to tray savage out when it was the 'current' thing. And I missed the boat. I didn't even know the name of the boat it seems.

Jesus OK..

1. Hunt trains can be used to acquire materia, and like I said you can merchant and flip materia all the time through the course of a patch. I do it with crafting materia all the time. 7.3 will release, between now and 7.3 I will be slowly buying up Cunning Materia, I'll stockpile and horde an amount for myself and the market. When new crafted gear releases for DOH/L, I'll then put them on the market and sell at a surplus of what I purchased them for.
2. You do not need any advanced knowledge in economics, marketing or mathematics to pull it off.. It just requires a rudimentary understanding of the patch schedule, and keeping general track of how the game works.
3. The tomes are capped currently, you do not need the tomes indefinitely, 3-4 weeks before patch drops I personally start hoarding my tomes, and I'll save up to cap. I can keep them, see what new materials there and and then sell them off. In my case I use them to craft gear.
4. You stockpile your tomes, and then check party finder for the several dozens of crafters that are buying tomestone materials, or crafting gear on your tomes. Ask them what it means, they'll be happy to rinse you of 2000 tomes and give you between 2-4M Gil for it.
5. Hunt trains wish they could generate the same level of drama as what this chaotic raid has done.
6. Gil isn't free, you need to do some work for it.
7. If you thrive exclusively on challenge then go look at doing the solo extreme primals, stockpile materials from there. Celestial Kimono Remnant from Tsukuyomi Extreme is a good start.

[Gurgeh]

1: Do hunt trains
2: Skill Issue
3: By being subbed and doing content for long enough, or by supplementing that gear you have with drops from Alliance Raids.
4: The five materials used in crafted gear and the material used in creating current endgame potions all cost 20 Allagan Tomestones of Aesthetics.
5: If you don't have enough tomes, that's a skill issue. Grind more.
6: You're just showing that you want people to bend to your whims here instead of looking at what's actually going on or joining the community to go look at when trains are being scheduled.
7: "I want lots of money without putting in any effort!"
8: "This is too easy, it's boring so I don't want to do it."
Pick one of the two stances to have.
9: You should probably play a more appealing game if this is your stance.

Allliances what rubbish. Not out until after savage came out.

I took two weeks off work did nothing but play this game. But I wasn't skipping, I was suplimenting a bring MSQ with side quests to make it playabel. And even with two weeks off, I still got through the game late. I don't know what happened, but to me it seemed the only way to do savage back then was with crafted gear, and tomes were only usefull to upgrade. Thats right I hadn't even reached my first EX byt the time savage was out. Much less having time to level crafing to make my gear. What can i say I didn't have the gil and as I've already said, Ive played the game every day for four years, bought two houses.
I agree with the last one. Its 'very' clearly not for me. Not endgame anyway. Its totally, totally different. But without staying subbed the social goes as well. I just want to free style, and do the stuff thats clearly marked out. You need gil to savage when it comes out, and gil is just not clearly marked out. Not kind of gil you need for raid gear.

7: "I want lots of money without putting in any effort!"
8: "This is too easy, it's boring so I don't want to do it."
Pick one of the two stances to have.

I don't mind putting effort into battle, but not into working out longs chains of transactions to get from A > B> C > gil. OR lots of different things little hear little there. But not the retlentless slog for stuff like racing to level crafters in time to exclusion of all else. Hunt trains, that wasn't how hunt marks were supposed to be killed. They were supposed to be fun surely?
I need to understand want I'm supposed to do.

Your right its not for me. But I get a vibe they want more people in savage. But its software. They can change it. And they seem to be changing nothing. You want to convert casual gamers into raiders so you don't have to invest in other content then do that. For me the problem is I wanted to Enjoy MSQ organically > level crafting > do extremes > do savage when everyone else was. Savage came out and I hadn't even got to my first extreme, and I had no crafters ready to go. I was playing the game constantly, and I kind of enjoyed most of the MSQ except for the mass euthenasia at the end. (But I was flashing it out with side quests. Enjoying it, like the other four years)

At the end of the day I'm just slow and crap at the game. Try as I might playing all the time. I've just got nowhere.
I magine I'm not alone and so if I say something, it might actually help people like me join you. But I'm not sure there is anyone like me. The people like me, they already know they are done with even extreme and unreal. (and, yeh they've unsubbed and stopped)

I played the game constaly since it came out. Even two weeks of work. I finally finished MSQ on 22 July I think.I say I did side quests, but not really. I'd like follow up on some of the more intersting aetherite chain stories, and I helped about three forlorn looking NPCs. Apart form that it was just having fun in dawn trail. I couldn't have gone faster without ruining it. I was doing what I was thought I was supposed to do.
Maybe I had 'good enough' gear, but I also rememebr being worried abut goign into savage with minIlvl gear, I'd never even done extremes on minIlvl. I think I waited a bit to gear up for extreeemes. Maybe thats what fcksd me. I don't know.

Don't feel sorry or me. it sjust a game. It just seems a shame. Especially if I'm not the only one. I WISH, they'd explained some of this in the othr four years I've been playing.