Damage gap closer should vanish

[Oizen]

I want a tank that does not have a snap to boss gap closer but instead freeform mobility.

The fact they're not even willing to entertain that idea doesn't give me much hope for 8.0 Job Identity patch tm

[Carighan]

I want a tank that does not have a snap to boss gap closer but instead freeform mobility.

The fact they're not even willing to entertain that idea doesn't give me much hope for 8.0 Job Identity patch tm

I was hoping that gunbreaker would actually use the gun-part more as a gun, too, and hence all abilities have 25y reach and just use a different animation when out of melee, aye. That'd be wild. Very little imbalance potential, but damn cool identity potential.

[Valence]

for the same reason you use any other damage ability in combat.
It does damage, so it is required to kill the boss.

If you don't use it you lose damage, if you have a 10 Minute fight, that's 20 Gap Closers you are not utilizing, which is a Loss of 3.000 potency in damage.

If you don't understand that, you don't understand the game.


Mobility skills should never do damage, that is a core design flaw, you can debate if there is a secondary effect like a stun or snare to them, but not Damage.

And let me guess, not using them within raid buffs is going to make you miss an enrage?

And why would you not use those 20 gap closers, either for mobility or damage when warranted?

[Rithy255]

Intervene is mine you cannot take intervene away
I think the current system is fine, it's something extra to give WAR/PLD to think about those tanks are already lower on ogcd's I would rather we keep the damage aspect of them both.

Personally I disagree with "mobility skills should never do damage" because it adds actual strategy to holding or spending those mobility skills it's rigid design for sure but some level of that is good with jobs, I think we've gone way too much in the direction of making everything all samey and sanitised.

[Arohk]

And let me guess, not using them within raid buffs is going to make you miss an enrage?

I have wiped to 0.1% a few times, so it is certainly a factor

[Reinhardt_Azureheim]

I have wiped to 0.1% a few times, so it is certainly a factor

...0.1% enrages are not because you allocated dashes away from raidbuff/selfbuff windows and actually used a charge to dash back to a boss for uptime rather than walking.

The whole point of allocating your dashes for this is to increase your GCD uptime, which is a DPS increase and keeps your GCD cycle from drifting. You can more likely blame unlucky crit rates or one of your four DPS players making rotational mistakes before moving a dash worth 150 potency out of thousands more per buff cycle out of said cycle.

If this was ARR damage numbers, sure we can talk about it, but in Ultimates + Dawntrail, surely not.

[Arohk]

...0.1% enrages are not because you allocated dashes away from raidbuff/selfbuff windows and actually used a charge to dash back to a boss for uptime rather than walking.

My Point was that every little bit of damage counts, so not using your dashes for damage can make a difference.

[Reinhardt_Azureheim]

My Point was that every little bit of damage counts, so not using your dashes for damage can make a difference.

Of course - nobody is asking you to sit on two charges of your dash and not use it and let the cooldown just drift. You have charges for this reason - use some for damage, hold one or two (WAR) where needed when it would cost you more damage from drifting GCD/using Tomahawk than you'd gain bonus potency from a raid buff window.

[Azurarok]

With PLD you could often get away with disengagement scenarios using the flexible holy spirit in your filler.

WAR's has a maximum of 3 charges and the job doesn't have a damage buff on its odd minute burst so it does have one it can use outside the raid buff window.

[Carighan]

Personally I disagree with "mobility skills should never do damage" because it adds actual strategy to holding or spending those mobility skills it's rigid design for sure but some level of that is good with jobs, I think we've gone way too much in the direction of making everything all samey and sanitised.

In a lot of ways dual-skills like that are very smart design. Of course gaining uptime is usually the highest gain of DPS, so that's the best use of a gapcloser, but do you really want to hold one for that? -> Actual in-fight decisionmaking

The reason it doesn't work comes from a wholly different direction: Melee DPS, and their lack of emotional stability. So as melees struggled with the "classic" melee balance (significantly higher DPS output but significant lack of uptime lest you die in many fights), modern fights are designed for ~100% melee uptime. And as a result, there's never a reason for a tank to hold back a (damaging) gapcloser to actually gapclose with. That second part is what is missing! If we had a need to close gaps in fights, gapcloser balance would be interesting if they also deal damage!