Frontlines: Leechers and Feeders

[Archeron]

I love hearing people just come out with "Keep it simple, and keep it fun, and keep the jobs somewhat balanced. Thats all it takes for PvP to thrive."

Well- if it was easy to do then anyone would just crank out PvP blockbuster AAA games by the dozen. In reality, you can probably focus on 1 or 2 of those objectives, but the third is going to be difficult to be done as well as you want.

Personally- I 'm not really motivated by "simple", fun of course is relative but I do want it to be fun, and I do want balance to be stressed. I don't want the PvP team to look at balance changes only ever 2 years (i.e. as per the present) - however I don't want them to go overboard and have some FOMO with major nerfs etc every minor release.

I agree that the FFXIV community is incentivized by rewards, every community is. As long as they are carefully considered, I don't have an issue with rewards. For that reason- adding some to RW would be fine. However- I like RW, I don't want the mode changed- for that reason, I have long wanted the mandatory completion of a tutorial quest for both FL and especially RW - that would also include concepts such as setting up - there's a lot of ground to cover- aside from the UI and the maps, and the basic strategy - there's the basics -PvP hotbars, switching jobs, etc.

If you're going to reply to me, use my name next time.

Why do you suppose that 15+ year old games STILL have lively PvP communities attached to them? It's because they adhere to the principles of simplicity. Modern Triple AAA Don't want block buster titles. They want fast cash, with as little investment as possible. Pay to win games full to the brim with microtransactions, cosmetics, gacha, and FoMo. Milk the whales, kill the game when things slow down, repeat as necessary. FFXIV wants to hold people hostage to the subscription. You better believe there is going to be more FoMo to keep you playing, and paying, regardless of how bad the PvP matches get, or how long the content droughts become.

If you need a wall of text to explain how a PvP mode functions, you've already failed. FFXIV is a community of PvE players, which is fantastic because they don't even understand dying on Frontlines costs their team points, or that they can change jobs mid match at the spawn point. If they can't even figure that out, they're never going to understand Rival Wings. There is too much ground to cover, and nobody is going to care to find out because the queue is dead when the mogtome event ends, and even if the queue wasn't dead, there is still no incentive to perform well. Only for matches to end quickly, and if we ever got a roulette for Rival Wings I guarantee people would be complaining about it constantly.

[IDontPetLalas]

If you're going to reply to me, use my name next time.

Why do you suppose that 15+ year old games STILL have lively PvP communities attached to them? It's because they adhere to the principles of simplicity. Modern Triple AAA Don't want block buster titles. They want fast cash, with as little investment as possible. Pay to win games full to the brim with microtransactions, cosmetics, gacha, and FoMo. Milk the whales, kill the game when things slow down, repeat as necessary. FFXIV wants to hold people hostage to the subscription. You better believe there is going to be more FoMo to keep you playing, and paying, regardless of how bad the PvP matches get, or how long the content droughts become.

If you need a wall of text to explain how a PvP mode functions, you've already failed. FFXIV is a community of PvE players, which is fantastic because they don't even understand dying on Frontlines costs their team points, or that they can change jobs mid match at the spawn point. If they can't even figure that out, they're never going to understand Rival Wings. There is too much ground to cover, and nobody is going to care to find out because the queue is dead when the mogtome event ends, and even if the queue wasn't dead, there is still no incentive to perform well. Only for matches to end quickly, and if we ever got a roulette for Rival Wings I guarantee people would be complaining about it constantly.

I agree that overly complex modes appeal to a niche market. I also agree that FFXIV is largely composed of PVE players. It's up to FFXIV whether they want to continue to support what is a a very small segment of their player population going forwards - personally I would see that it could stay on, but get minimal investment. PvP likely goes into modes that are, as you say- easier for people to jump into and understand.

If you seriously think that FFXIV PvP would ever resemble a P2P PvP game- I don't ever see that happening. There would have to be massive changes to the PvP system, in addition to the monetization system, I just don't see it. Not to mention - the game runs so poorly in PvP , just fixing that would be a major hurdle.