Disappointed of Dawntrail difficulty

[Tunda]

These people you describe are already the target audience for this type of content, you are clearly a midcore person so you should wait for savage to give your opinion on if YoshiP made content more difficult or not

This isnt your game lol, a lot of people of different skill levels play this game, accept their existence or simply quit playing

lol as if most people like the current game design

people are getting bored from Endwalker even Yoshi P mentioned that

have you read all the posts of people complaining about this expansion? or are you blind? jobs.. encounters.. rewards.. you are one who is out of touch stop worshipping the game like as if it is your identity you look pathetically looser

[Wildheaven182]

These people you describe are already the target audience for this type of content, you are clearly a midcore person so you should wait for savage to give your opinion on if YoshiP made content more difficult or not

This isnt your game lol, a lot of people of different skill levels play this game, accept their existence or simply quit playing

Midcore players dont play savage.

[LilyPendragon]

Midcore players dont play savage.

Lol they absolutely do. I'd call myself midcore and still do savage (though usually get bored by the time fourth floor rolls around).

[Masekase_Hurricane]

Midcore players dont play savage.

I disagree a midcore player is someone who would jump into a pick up group or build one but never commit to a static. A raider will have a static and commit to a few runs a week and then there's the world first groups who will spam till its cleared. To me a casual player is someone who caps their weekly tomes, grabs their weekly drops and plays 2-3 hours a night.
Now we have this new group the storytelling grandmas who dont want any form of difficulty and are just there to piss, moan and finish the story.

[ForteNightshade]

Eh,

It's relative to the target audience of that content more than anything, and I do believe that when Yoshida made comments, it was in reference to introducing more stress back into the game, not necessarily making the game itself more difficult. This stress can come in several different ways aside from difficulty.

I think from my perspective, I didn't find them much more difficult mechanically, but these encounters did have more pacing over what they've had in the past, honestly. So there's a bit of an adjustment there, and though none of them are really new mechanics... How the mechanics are signaled, I do find different, however.

I think if you are a low-skilled casual, then you are more inclined to notice difficulty, but I think if you are slightly above average skill level, even at casual level, then you are more than likely to be OK with it and potentially not notice much difference.

As dismissive as this comes across, it does reign true, but if you are really looking for that difficulty, then really you should be waiting until savage and ultimate releases as opposed to the early on Ex encounters and arguably story-mode content.

I think this is an important distinction people may be forgetting. Take the second boss from Vanguard. While still fairly easy, asking the player to repeatedly dodge fast targeted AoEs is a form of stress, especially at the targeted audience they're aiming for with dungeon design. My only real complaint is you do eventually realize getting hit by said AoEs is very forgetting, which makes dodging less of a concern. Nonetheless, the thought is there.

If you were ever expecting dungeons to have a real upswing, I hate to break it to you but that will never happen. They want casual content to be readily accessible to most skill levels. A problem several players have is underestimating their own skill level when posting about difficult. I think we all are guilty of that to some extent. Basically, most people posting online are better than they think they are even they're still casual.

[EponaTBHSMH]

lol as if most people like the current game design

people are getting bored from Endwalker even Yoshi P mentioned that

have you read all the posts of people complaining about this expansion? or are you blind? jobs.. encounters.. rewards.. you are one who is out of touch stop worshipping the game like as if it is your identity you look pathetically looser

Your reply has literally nothing to do with anything I said

I never said people liked the current game design, or that people weren't bored with Endwalker, or that people we're not complaining

You're so focused on insulting me that you aren't even reading my post before replying: I'm saying again that people like you that do harder content aren't the targets of these changes that's why you find it easy. As you can see from the complaints about difficulty, casuals find it hard

Savage is a better way for you to judge is YoshiP made content harder for people like you, so again, you're butting in your opinion in normal content changes, those aren't designed to challenge people of your skill level even if they are harder

[Kaurhz]

TBH I didnt even touch ex2 reason is simple

Rewards are not enough and it isn't worth it

Tbh, I don't think you should be complaining about difficulty then if you're only really selectively the actual difficulty as and when the carrot is sweet enough for you. As, if you actually cared about it (difficulty) and being engaged then you would be doing that content regardless of whether you feel it is rewarding enough.

[Tunda]

Tbh, I don't think you should be complaining about difficulty then if you're only really selectively the actual difficulty as and when the carrot is sweet enough for you. As, if you actually cared about it (difficulty) and being engaged then you would be doing that content regardless of whether you feel it is rewarding enough.

This response comes from people who don't understand the psychology of games being rewarding and engagement..

hard fights should be rewarding not only from enjoyment but from rewards after kill.

But I know there is people here didn't even play Mario games before so they can't understand how to approach progression based games.

[Kaurhz]

This response comes from people who don't understand the psychology of games being rewarding and engagement..

hard fights should be rewarding not only from enjoyment but from rewards after kill.

But I know there is people here didn't even play Mario games before so they can't understand how to approach progression based games.

The response is coming from someone who is effectively commenting on what is effectively a double standard here.

So do enlighten everyone then on what your intended reward would be to compensate for the request of every increasing difficulty. Pray tell what the compensation reward is for those that will be doing the content as part of their roulette that will potentially be spending an entire lockout on the instance to help people that may get stonewalled, because some random genius on the forum thinks that Normal mode content should cater to his desired level of difficulty, despite actually not fully engaging in the already difficult content. - and yes I am well aware of the fact that nobody is requesting, for example, savage difficulty, but what you seem to fail to realize is that normal mode content is story content, it's designed to present limited challenge (this is their perfect middle-ground) to the target audience, and if you are an alleged midcore player, then I can assure you that you are not the target audience for normal mode, nor expert roulette for that matter, seeing is story mode ultimately encompasses the latter.

and frankly, if reward structure and progression is your issue, then this should be your complaint (additional incentives to do that harder content). Your complaint should not be what it is, but you do you.

Your response and your final comment isn't as clever as you think it was, but it's OK.

[Kaurhz]

I think this is an important distinction people may be forgetting. Take the second boss from Vanguard. While still fairly easy, asking the player to repeatedly dodge fast targeted AoEs is a form of stress, especially at the targeted audience they're aiming for with dungeon design. My only real complaint is you do eventually realize getting hit by said AoEs is very forgetting, which makes dodging less of a concern. Nonetheless, the thought is there.

If you were ever expecting dungeons to have a real upswing, I hate to break it to you but that will never happen. They want casual content to be readily accessible to most skill levels. A problem several players have is underestimating their own skill level when posting about difficult. I think we all are guilty of that to some extent. Basically, most people posting online are better than they think they are even they're still casual.

This is personally where I think their intended stress is going to be for normal content. Pacing is easily enough adaptable and can keep the fight engaging for anyone without necessarily compromising on making the content too difficult as to potentially stonewall people or change the target audience entirely. Can't speak on beyond that, isn't my place. But the original comments were about stress, and that stress takes on a variety of forms aside from "just ramp up the difficulty" - Which Yoshida commented on at the time. I think if they want to step up the difficulty of that entry content, then they really ought to be spending a lot of time nurturing the content that has had its teeth lost to time, e.g., ARR > SB content.

This final part of yours I think is spot on. This is the intended audience. Easily accessible to most skill levels, and frankly anyone that tries to pay attention, but still has the risk of wiping people. I still have healers and such getting taken down by final boss on level 95 dungeon and final boss of level 91 dungeon. Just as I have seen people get baited by the Cross AoEs and circular AoEs on the first dungeon of Alexandria. There is still some legitimate threat to a casual or lower-skilled player. Personally, I'm a casual player by nearly every stretch of the definition (outside of DoH/L), most dungeons I found easy but required some level of engagement or paying attention, e.g., the order of AoEs in Alexandria, or positioning myself to not get crushed by unfortunate positioning on the Level 91 boss (I've absolutely seen people essentially do themselves in because of their position alone). But even these things are just things that people don't pay attention to when actually doing the dungeon. Some will treat it as reactionary, and just react to the bosses, but some will treat it as more of a dance and will know the sequence, and I think something like this is a mentality thing, and when you have that mentality it's not really easier to create that desired difficulty/swing without changing the target audience for that content entirely.