Wow, Wuk Lamat is really single-handedly ruining the DT story...

[Midare]

Instead they went for ARR writing and EW stakes with a new WoL more or less.

I must be part of the minority here, but I didn't think ARR writing was bad. Slow, yes, the pacing was abysmal and it dragged on at points, but it wasn't bad.

I already thought that way before Dawntrail, but Wut Lmao made me appreciate ARR all the more.

[Alchemii]

But hey, we have an easy way to troll reddit now. Just say you wanted another character to be the main focus of the plot instead of Wuk(awasteofspace) and they'll lose their minds.

[SamuraiMiqo]

I went into this expansion liking Wuk Lamat. By the end of the MSQ, I keep desperately hoping she's not going to end up joining the Scions or something somehow, since she's ran rampant over everything else in this expansion so far. Sick of seeing her, sick of hearing her voice. Go away, house cat.

Unfortunately, this ended up being me as well. I liked her in the first half the expansion..but by the second half I just wanted the story to focus on Erenville and Krile. Once I did the final trial, I was angry at how she was shoehorned into it.

[ZephyrMenodora]

It would not be okay Ish. It would be the lowest rated and worst expansion as it is currently.

In my personal opinion, it's also cringe the way people talk about the character as though she is real. She is not. She is a poorly written character amongst many other poorly written things in DT. Maybe that's what people are trying to say in some of the rants I've seen.

I'm also not calling for anyone to stop talking. I am telling you that devs tend to interpret feedback a certain way and if what they garner from the expansion is "I hate Wuk Lamat" then we just won't see her again. The problem is, the odds you would see her again anyway are 0.005%. You can still continue to hate on a character that is not real, be my guest.

I would also note you're not even being objective. When you say "Wuk Lamat is the most inconsistent." Based on what metric? Every Scion we know acts out of character at some point and even new ones, like Bakool ja ja become unrecognizable once converted from cartoonist evil to good.

You are positing things like "if wuk lamat didn't exist, Krile's story would be well written." That is a contradiction considering this writer wrote this MSQ. They wrote Wuk Lamat. A lot of these arguments are copium.

I have no idea why you harp so much on fictional characters not being real. It's cringe. We know they are fictional characters, written by writers. No one thinks she's a real person. People criticize fictional characters, there are entire college courses on literary criticism, there are entire academic books on various fictional characters in Shakespeare plays. Fictional characters not being real is a given.

You can like or be fine with a writers work in some areas and have specific problem areas. I like Koana and Sphene, for example. But Wuk is another story. She was written so terribly, acted by a bad voice actor, and thrown in our faces for the entire MSQ we are sending the message we don't want to see this character again, or anyone else with her archetype or approach. I don't even want them to attempt writing more of her to try to redeem how utterly irritating she was to me.

Since I feel you need someone to state the obvious, this of course is all my opinion.

[ZephyrMenodora]

I have no idea why you call it harping. It's just a fact. Wuk Lamat isn't real. She can't "single handedly ruin a story". You can phrase things that way, and many have in this thread and others, it just means I personally perceive it as hate vs criticism.

Let me use an example. People hated Lyse. Writers certainly got that feedback right? Yet they created a new character who is like 2x her presence and a polar opposite disposition. When you tell writers you hate a character, it's less effective than just saying please don't write protagonists who replace the WoL in the story. Not for half a story, a full story or at all. I am not telling anyone to stop giving feedback. I am telling you that vitriol aimed at a character probably won't get you what you want.

Another thing I would say is that it's funny you brought up the VA because of course you did.

Objectively, Wuk Lamat being "shoved in your face"-- that's a writing issue. It's not a character issue. If you don't want any character playing that kind of role in the story, it has nothing to do with Wuk Lamat.

You mentioned 'Wuk Lamat isn't real" several times now, I recall just shaking my head as I have no idea what kind of point you think you are making with this, and commented as I saw you write this yet again. It's a pointless argument about semantics. People discuss characters, and don't need to preface every comment about a character with "the writers of the character". It's not how people discuss fiction - like I said, it's a given that a fictional character has a writer/designer behind the scenes.

Hatred of a character comes from the character's writing, design, and acting. All three are an unfortunate hurricane of terrible when it comes to Wuk Lamat - again in case it's not obvious - in my opinion. An improvement on any of the three would have helped. Here, for me, it's terrible from all directions. I mentioned the actors because FFXIV primary characters have actors, and how they perform also influences how much we like a character. I can find Graha annoying, but like how Jonathan Bailey sounds in the role, so his acting improved how much I liked the character even if the writing for him sometimes irks me. These characters in this medium don't exist in a vacuum, so "of course" I'd also mention the poor performance.

Since you aren't seeing that people's distaste of Wuk Lamat is layered and multifaceted, I'd also like to point out that people can:
1. Not want any ONE character taking over an entire expansion, whether they like the character or not,
2. Dislike everything about Wuk Lamat like I do, and
3. Find that the writers failed both in character writing and character allotment simultaneously, but due to how terrible Wuk us, the issue that she is omnipresent creates a far bigger issue in that she is so irritating, that she makes the overall experience worse than if someone liked the star of the story.

[Voidmage]

I have no idea why you call it harping. It's just a fact. Wuk Lamat isn't real. She can't "single handedly ruin a story". You can phrase things that way, and many have in this thread and others, it just means I personally perceive it as hate vs criticism.

A character doesn't have to be real to be regarded as ruining a story. That's called the Scrappy.

Mind you I don't know if Wuk Lamat ruins the story alone because thats subjective (for me she does) but she is probably the biggest factor for those who dislike the MSQ.

Let me use an example. People hated Lyse. Writers certainly got that feedback right? Yet they created a new character who is like 2x her presence and a polar opposite disposition. When you tell writers you hate a character, it's less effective than just saying please don't write protagonists who replace the WoL in the story. Not for half a story, a full story or at all. I am not telling anyone to stop giving feedback. I am telling you that vitriol aimed at a character probably won't get you what you want.

We are just customers and fans. We don't need to write an essay for criticism.
The devs know that people hate a character. How they answer that is their problem. There is normaly an entire department for stuff like that.
Saying "hey Square, this character sucks and ruins the story" shouldn't be answered with "understood, here have another character that's even worse then before".
They get payed to think themself.

Also there have been entire threads about what the problems are even in this thread here itself.
If the devs don't see the reasons then they don't want to see them.

[LyraShu]

I have no idea why you call it harping. It's just a fact. Wuk Lamat isn't real. She can't "single handedly ruin a story". You can phrase things that way, and many have in this thread and others, it just means I personally perceive it as hate vs criticism.

Let me use an example. People hated Lyse. Writers certainly got that feedback right? Yet they created a new character who is like 2x her presence and a polar opposite disposition. When you tell writers you hate a character, it's less effective than just saying please don't write protagonists who replace the WoL in the story. Not for half a story, a full story or at all. I am not telling anyone to stop giving feedback. I am telling you that vitriol aimed at a character probably won't get you what you want.

Another thing I would say is that it's funny you brought up the VA because of course you did.

Objectively, Wuk Lamat being "shoved in your face"-- that's a writing issue. It's not a character issue. If you don't want any character playing that kind of role in the story, it has nothing to do with Wuk Lamat.

Also you can like part of the writing. The problem is saying "Without Wuk Lamat Kriles story would be good". You literally don't know that. You can say it, I'm just saying it's not true.

Lol, if you think "single handedly ruin a story" is being hateful, then I can only say that I am super happy that you have had a nice time in life

You also seem to be hung up on semantics, when people just want to share their viewpoints and thoughts. Right or wrong, it doesn't actually matter. Remember, these are just words on a screen to you so it's not like you should worry that much.

Regardless, I hope you have a great day!~

[Reimmi]

I guess we should just keep throwing our money at SE and eat the crap they serve us. I'm all for constructive criticism and giving devs the benefit of the doubt, they're not superhumans after all, but story, the one thing that is universally praised about the game, taking a massive dive into the dumpster should be alarming to anyone who cares about the game.

personally playing for the gameplay alone, the content seems to be a setp up from endwalker.
Story is hot ass tho so hopefully they improve

[Topaz2510]

I love her, shes fun

[ZephyrMenodora]

My posts aren't really about people giving multifaceted feedback, it's moreso a reaction to this idea that one singular character ruins the story and that writing will automatically be good if she isn't around. Imo, this feedback is not only less effective but pretty harmful, because it gives the impression that if Wuk Lamat disappeared from DT, or disappears in the future, everything will automatically be ok. I've already seen people doing this with respect to the Arcadion or even within the MSQ itself when she's not around. People are welcome to submit that feedback and feel that way, but I how I feel is that there's a lot more work to be done beyond that. The writing problems with Wuk Lamat are pervasive and extend to characters we know already and love already. I don't think it has to do with any characters, including Wuk Lamat, I think it has to do with how they are used and how they are written.

No, it wouldn't fix everything. Someone wrote this character. Someone approved of her design and extensive use in the story. Someone approved Sena's hire and ear-plug inspiring performance reaching our ears.

But the disappearance of Wuk Lamat would be a good start.