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  1. #1
    Player
    PyurBlue's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Posts
    799
    Character
    Saphir Amariyo
    World
    Brynhildr
    Main Class
    Thaumaturge Lv 40
    Quote Originally Posted by Granyala View Post
    Power progression is normal in MMOs and a, if not the main thing that keeps people playing.
    If it isn't done via levels, it is done via gear. Old content would get trivialized just the same.
    I can only speak for myself, but the leveling does nothing for me. I got a few of my preferred classes to 100 and already forgot about levels. I was much more interested in seeing new fights, which I could have done with no leveling at all. I'm also not a fan of level sync, nor having to relearn classes every expansion because we have to delete some skills for new skills for the sake of having new skills, which are sometimes just rebranded old skills anyway.

    It would seem absolutely part of the popular opinion that leveling is a part of the this genre, but I'd prefer if MMO's didn't have levels at all, didn't have content with a limited shelf life, and instead offered deeper gameplay where progression was achieved through the player improving instead of stats. My level is 100 now, but nothing meaningful has changed. The enemies are also level 100, their stats raised with mine and the number is ultimately meaningless. I'm also so much stronger than a low level player that I can't really do anything with them because any attack I'd use would trivialize their content.

    A levelless world would also be nice as far as exploration goes. In ARR when you started the game you had the freedom to go almost anywhere. Subsequent expansions have carefully close off the world and sectioned it by level. I find it so boring and predictable. I have no doubts that a more free flowing story could be created and along with it and less linear path through the world where we have more meaning exploration. This would also allow for more meaningful cooperation between players at different points in the game. With a massive powergap from level 1 to max, cooperate play becomes a lot easier and more balanced.
    (2)

  2. #2
    Player
    AmorfaVex's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2022
    Posts
    102
    Character
    Jack Garlund
    World
    Ultros
    Main Class
    Samurai Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by PyurBlue View Post
    I can only speak for myself, but the leveling does nothing for me. I got a few of my preferred classes to 100 and already forgot about levels. I was much more interested in seeing new fights, which I could have done with no leveling at all. I'm also not a fan of level sync, nor having to relearn classes every expansion because we have to delete some skills for new skills for the sake of having new skills, which are sometimes just rebranded old skills anyway.

    It would seem absolutely part of the popular opinion that leveling is a part of the this genre, but I'd prefer if MMO's didn't have levels at all, didn't have content with a limited shelf life, and instead offered deeper gameplay where progression was achieved through the player improving instead of stats. My level is 100 now, but nothing meaningful has changed. The enemies are also level 100, their stats raised with mine and the number is ultimately meaningless. I'm also so much stronger than a low level player that I can't really do anything with them because any attack I'd use would trivialize their content.

    A levelless world would also be nice as far as exploration goes. In ARR when you started the game you had the freedom to go almost anywhere. Subsequent expansions have carefully close off the world and sectioned it by level. I find it so boring and predictable. I have no doubts that a more free flowing story could be created and along with it and less linear path through the world where we have more meaning exploration. This would also allow for more meaningful cooperation between players at different points in the game. With a massive powergap from level 1 to max, cooperate play becomes a lot easier and more balanced.
    I'd touch on your last paragraph real quick.

    Back in the old days (yep, im one of those) They didnt need to seal off zones like that. If you strolled into a zone you shouldnt be in, you would get smeared and have to find people to help get your corpse back (talking Everquest here) It would and DID support community, where you'd need a necro to summon your corpse if you didnt know where it was, and a cleric to rez you, unless you were ok with massive xp loss/deleveling. If you didnt do a corpse retrieval, you lost everything on the corpse (after a few real life days.)

    I actually liked it, as masochistic as it sounds. You felt the danger.

    Now, games are entranced with the mob/player level scaling and or restricting access to zones.

    So while I agree with you, you should be able to go where you want, there need to be consequences if you get turned into paste by a mob in a zone you shouldnt be in yet.
    (1)

  3. #3
    Player
    Granyala's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Posts
    1,638
    Character
    Ifalna Sha'yoko
    World
    Cerberus
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by PyurBlue View Post
    I can only speak for myself, but the leveling does nothing for me.
    Same here, I never cared for it either. Too much content ending up as dead weight.
    Though I don't think my opinion is a majority opinion. Many people seem to enjoy leveling. *shrug*

    As for the class changes: Mixed bag. Some are great, some I could live without. Learning new stuff as the story progresses is cool, doesn't necessarily need arbitrary level numbers though.
    Quote Originally Posted by AmorfaVex View Post
    Back in the old days [..] You felt the danger.
    Tell me about it. Man, brand new in WoW, wanted a nice dress from an event and needed to go through a lv 35 zone as a level 6. :'D
    That was fun, especially if I found some kind strangers that helped me get there.
    (1)

  4. #4
    Player
    Evergrey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    2,021
    Character
    Rexipher Evergrey
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    Dark Knight Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Granyala View Post
    Same here, I never cared for it either. Too much content ending up as dead weight.
    Though I don't think my opinion is a majority opinion. Many people seem to enjoy leveling. *shrug*

    As for the class changes: Mixed bag. Some are great, some I could live without. Learning new stuff as the story progresses is cool, doesn't necessarily need arbitrary level numbers though.

    Tell me about it. Man, brand new in WoW, wanted a nice dress from an event and needed to go through a lv 35 zone as a level 6. :'D
    That was fun, especially if I found some kind strangers that helped me get there.
    I really enjoy ESO's scaling system.
    It makes it so no matter the level any content will always be (more or less) relevant.
    And since no one out level zones every zone still holds worth in them.
    Heck, took me like 1 year before I even started the MSQ, as I was simply exploring and having a blast just doing what ever I felt for when ever.
    (1)