BLM needs a rework because of new content difficulty

[Rekujin]

The problem isn't Picto, the problem is BLM.

Both are 'selfish dps' and should be competing with melee, the problem is BLM plays horribly and on top of that, doesn't have the potency to back it up. I rarely see BLM in parties now, very sad.

[Realfoxy]

Well, no, I do think the skill floor is getting a Flare Star each astral cycle. I just think the job gives you the tools to do that reliably if you don't try to spend those tools on increasing your damage instead...


If some otherwise-defensible sequence of Thunder refresh and Manafont activation and so on puts you in a situation where your Thunder falls off and then stays off for 3 or 4 seconds before being reapplied, that's just how the job works, no more your fault than a failure to cast more than one Flare Star per astral cycle is. It's like how the GNB Bow Shock or whatever it's called DoT doesn't actually have 100% uptime either...

I don't think Manafont drift is a serious issue either...

See the issue I have with the above statements is that none of these were problems with Endwalker Black Mage. In Endwalker, we didn't have this Thunderhead system and you were much more free with your DOT refresh. In Endwalker, you didn't have a restrictive Flare Star system so you didn't have to play super conservatively with your fire phase. In Endwalker, Manafont wasn't such a major damage cooldown that drifting it didn't feel as bad. A well designed job should lead players into the standard rotation and make it feel good to execute. Dawntrail BLM doesn't do that. It has a number of traps for new players, and while free F3p helps, it has more ways to bleed damage than in Endwalker.

I should be excited about a new expansion and new things added to my job. I expect better from SE, and while sure I can settle I don't consider "oh missing DOT / unavoidable drift etc. are just part of the job now. Have fun!" to be good design. They have deliberately introduced these things into the job! They didn't have to do that!

There are lots of ways to fix things - e.g. your suggested change to Despair. For example, they could allow the thunder DOT timer to be increased to 60s and increase the proc to 40s - that would give some freedom back. However I'm not going to close my eyes and pretend the job as it is right now in 7.0 is any kind of improvement over 6.5 BLM.

[Galvuu]

Can we like... just get EW BLM back, make Despair give 2 astral heart stacks and buff Flare Star? That's all I want. That'd be perfect, really.

[Ferrinus]

See the issue I have with the above statements is that none of these were problems with Endwalker Black Mage. In Endwalker, we didn't have this Thunderhead system and you were much more free with your DOT refresh. In Endwalker, you didn't have a restrictive Flare Star system so you didn't have to play super conservatively with your fire phase. In Endwalker, Manafont wasn't such a major damage cooldown that drifting it didn't feel as bad. A well designed job should lead players into the standard rotation and make it feel good to execute. Dawntrail BLM doesn't do that. It has a number of traps for new players, and while free F3p helps, it has more ways to bleed damage than in Endwalker.

I should be excited about a new expansion and new things added to my job. I expect better from SE, and while sure I can settle I don't consider "oh missing DOT / unavoidable drift etc. are just part of the job now. Have fun!" to be good design. They have deliberately introduced these things into the job! They didn't have to do that!

There are lots of ways to fix things - e.g. your suggested change to Despair. For example, they could allow the thunder DOT timer to be increased to 60s and increase the proc to 40s - that would give some freedom back. However I'm not going to close my eyes and pretend the job as it is right now in 7.0 is any kind of improvement over 6.5 BLM.

They weren't problems with EW Black Mage... which is why I agree the job has gotten harder to play at a higher level. But I don't think it's gotten harder to play or more forbidding at a lower level, because it's more obvious what you're supposed to do and extra instant casts + less frequent oGCD weaving has made doing that thing more forgiving. I definitely think removing Thunderhead entirely would make things less frustrating for experienced players while either not affecting or actually helping beginner players (my assumption here is that the Thunder spells remain 0s cast time and 0mp DoTs only castable when in an elemental aspect), and some mechanic by which a Flare Star is guaranteed at the end of every astral cycle will help everybody.

I think it'd be difficult to retool the class such that Manafont doesn't drift because of the nature of what Manafont actually gives you; it's not like Amplifier or Delirium or something, after all, it actually cares about your current resource totals, and your resources are what you spend to deal damage, and you already want to spend those most efficiently whenever you've got them. Actually, it occurs to me that you could make Manafont work like an MP-based Excogitation: it'd give you a ~30s status that, upon your MP dropping below 800 in astral phase, instantly triggers and refreshes all your resources. The 100s cooldown has been working for me, but going back to a 120s cooldown and making the actual effect a delayed trigger could make everyone happy.

I've posted it elsewhere, but here's an HUD-only change I'm desperate for: instead of a separate Astral Gauge, they should just make Astral Soul stacks replace Umbral Hearts as you gain them. Then, once you've got three, those three light up one by one, and then you can Flare Star. (Then, for an actual mechanical change, dropping to 0mp by casting Flare or Despair could automatically light up any existing astral hearts with a slightly dimmer glow indicating that each one is sapping your Flare Star of 20 potency or something.)

[Altera]

The problem isn't Picto, the problem is BLM.

Both are 'selfish dps' and should be competing with melee, the problem is BLM plays horribly and on top of that, doesn't have the potency to back it up. I rarely see BLM in parties now, very sad.

No. I would never think of Pictomancers as Selfish DPS unless they are stripped of everything party utility like a BLM.. And then if they also becomes as hard to play as BLM, it would be acceptable to have PIC be neck and neck with BLM, SAM. MCH should be even higher than PICs as they are more selfish than PICs. PICs are way too overtuned if they are to buff every single other job to even compete to them.

BLMs dont only need a big potency increase. But also some QoL changes to their new reworked spells as atm it is very annoying to play with Flarestar so easily lost. BLM in EW was so smooth to cast and use abilities, now its very clunky and busy. And VPR are getting changes as their job was busy xD

[Supersnow845]

No. I would never think of Pictomancers as Selfish DPS unless they are stripped of everything party utility like a BLM.. And then if they also becomes as hard to play as BLM, it would be acceptable to have PIC be neck and neck with BLM, SAM. MCH should be even higher than PICs as they are more selfish than PICs. PICs are way too overtuned if they are to buff every single other job to even compete to them.

That’s the balance PCT has, PCT is only “overtuned” at the 100th percentile, if you look at PCT’s balance at the 25th 50th and 75th percentile PCT sits exactly where people expected it to sit- around the low to mid melee range which makes sense given its utility. PCT only pulls ahead at 100th because it can stuff so many high potency attacks in its burst window- more than any other class and if you crit them all your potential is insane

If you nerf PCT to bring down its 100th percentile potential then your 25th 50th and 75th percentile balance falls dangerously close to not being worth bringing over the rezz casters

[Corwin_Sunchaser]

No. I would never think of Pictomancers as Selfish DPS unless they are stripped of everything party utility like a BLM.. And then if they also becomes as hard to play as BLM, it would be acceptable to have PIC be neck and neck with BLM, SAM. MCH should be even higher than PICs as they are more selfish than PICs. PICs are way too overtuned if they are to buff every single other job to even compete to them.

BLMs dont only need a big potency increase. But also some QoL changes to their new reworked spells as atm it is very annoying to play with Flarestar so easily lost. BLM in EW was so smooth to cast and use abilities, now its very clunky and busy. And VPR are getting changes as their job was busy xD

I agree with you on all account.

Saying that PIC is a "selfish DPS" when you compare it to a BLM or MCH… what a joke.

Btw why is MCH at the very bottom by a decent margin as a "Selfish DPS"? Competing with melees? Not even close!

BLMs needs to be able to handle all kind of boss fights, not only those with low mobility requirements.
Melees can’t do positionals on wall boss, then get a free pass.
BLMs can’t dps because the fight needs to move every 2seconds… too bad! And good luck if there is an add phase or a boss disparition!

[Altera]

That’s the balance PCT has, PCT is only “overtuned” at the 100th percentile, if you look at PCT’s balance at the 25th 50th and 75th percentile PCT sits exactly where people expected it to sit- around the low to mid melee range which makes sense given its utility. PCT only pulls ahead at 100th because it can stuff so many high potency attacks in its burst window- more than any other class and if you crit them all your potential is insane

If you nerf PCT to bring down its 100th percentile potential then your 25th 50th and 75th percentile balance falls dangerously close to not being worth bringing over the rezz casters

I wouldnt bother going by Percentile balancing under 80%. As if a Job is played to its best potential, thats where one should balance them to. And at 75-100%, PICs do not drop below 3rd spot. BLMs are kissing the floor in all %tiles

[Galvuu]

I wouldnt bother going by Percentile balancing under 80%. As if a Job is played to its best potential, thats where one should balance them to. And at 75-100%, PICs do not drop below 3rd spot. BLMs are kissing the floor in all %tiles

Any cutoff percentile depends heavily on fight design and strat. 80% is probably safe, but the top 1% defo usually has some catering done to it.
By the cutoff you propose, Picto is behind every melee except NIN on rdps. It defo doesn't need a nerf.

Either way, I actually agree that PCT is fine where it is. BLM should simply be above it.
I think I was held hostage to double melee meta for so long that I forgot that, in ShB, SMN was more or less where PCT is after 5.3.
So PCT stays and BLM just needs to be tied for highest adps, or be highest outright if fight design continues recent trends.

[Realfoxy]

...
I think it'd be difficult to retool the class such that Manafont doesn't drift because of the nature of what Manafont actually gives you; it's not like Amplifier or Delirium or something, after all, it actually cares about your current resource totals, and your resources are what you spend to deal damage, and you already want to spend those most efficiently whenever you've got them. Actually, it occurs to me that you could make Manafont work like an MP-based Excogitation: it'd give you a ~30s status that, upon your MP dropping below 800 in astral phase, instantly triggers and refreshes all your resources. The 100s cooldown has been working for me, but going back to a 120s cooldown and making the actual effect a delayed trigger could make everyone happy.

I've posted it elsewhere, but here's an HUD-only change I'm desperate for: instead of a separate Astral Gauge, they should just make Astral Soul stacks replace Umbral Hearts as you gain them. Then, once you've got three, those three light up one by one, and then you can Flare Star. (Then, for an actual mechanical change, dropping to 0mp by casting Flare or Despair could automatically light up any existing astral hearts with a slightly dimmer glow indicating that each one is sapping your Flare Star of 20 potency or something.)

I don't think the excog idea is good, since if it refreshes after despair then your Flare Star will make the manafont fire phase a lot tighter (though you could just make FS refresh AF like I mentioned before). It also wouldn't completely solve the drift problem since you'd still want to use it off cooldown.

I think you could easily fix Manafont by just giving it charges. Decreasing the cooldown to 100s just made the drift problem worse - the shorter the cooldown, the more likely you are to lose a use by drifting. 100s only made it easier to align with 2min cooldowns, but that's pointless because Manafont is not something that gives you burst anyway, yet another example of how SE just does not understand how this job actually functions in fights.