Wow, Wuk Lamat is really single-handedly ruining the DT story...

[CerusSerenade]

Oh, come on, stop it with Transphobia stuff. Why do many people think that saying Wuk Lamat is not a well-made character is a dog whistle for transphobe?? Is it because of the character's English VA is a trans person? What's next? If the female voiced character gets criticized, does that make the criticizers misogynist too?

I will not, especially when I have personally seen a GREAT amount of transphobia surrounding the character and her English VA. Especially now that certain figures have attached themselves to the whole thing, there is a substantial amount of people who dislike the character for no reason other than their favorite internet personality said to for transphobic or other asinine reasons.

[Malthir]

I will not, especially when I have personally seen a GREAT amount of transphobia surrounding the character and her English VA. Especially now that certain figures have attached themselves to the whole thing, there is a substantial amount of people who dislike the character for no reason other than their favorite internet personality said to for transphobic or other asinine reasons.

Right, but the JP forum is also critical of her and it's a different VA so I kinda feel you're full of it. So while there maybe a tiny amount of morons spouting stuff, the VAST majority of the criticism has been aimed at the character not the VA, and the vast majority of the criticism of the VA has been about her not being good. The first to talk about her being trans was a game journo, almost as if they were trying to setup a scapegoat, trying to rile up the usual tiny contingent of clowns just so they can then try and brush away all the criticism about the poor quality of the VA and terrible terrible writing. I was here day 1 complaining about how terrible the story is, the initial posts talking about the bad VA went on for 2 days before anyone knew or mentioned the VA was trans. So again, you're full of it.

[KurenXIV]

Right, but the JP forum is also critical of her and it's a different VA so I kinda feel you're full of it. So while there maybe a tiny amount of morons spouting stuff, the VAST majority of the criticism has been aimed at the character not the VA, and the vast majority of the criticism of the VA has been about her not being good. The first to talk about her being trans was a game journo, almost as if they were trying to setup a scapegoat, trying to rile up the usual tiny contingent of clowns just so they can then try and brush away all the criticism about the poor quality of the VA and terrible terrible writing. I was here day 1 complaining about how terrible the story is, the initial posts talking about the bad VA went on for 2 days before anyone knew or mentioned the VA was trans. So again, you're full of it.

Seconded.

I also play with Japanese voices exclusively (have since STB) and I hate Wuk Lamat. The VA performance is perfectly fine on the JP end; it's the horrid writing and her being shoehorned into everything with zero growth that makes me dislike her so much.

[NiceNox]

Seconded.

I also play with Japanese voices exclusively (have since STB) and I hate Wuk Lamat. The VA performance is perfectly fine on the JP end; it's the horrid writing and her being shoehorned into everything with zero growth that makes me dislike her so much.

Same here, I also played through the MSQ with Japanese voices and I still found Wuk to be quite.....linear and not to my liking. To be honest, I've never felt this frustrated with any character this much. In my opinion, Wuk is borderline Mary Sue and that's a sign of something I don't really enjoy.

[Dogempire]

Same here, I also played through the MSQ with Japanese voices and I still found Wuk to be quite.....linear and not to my liking. To be honest, I've never felt this frustrated with any character this much. In my opinion, Wuk is borderline Mary Sue and that's a sign of something I don't really enjoy.

I'd argue that Wuk Lamat is a Mary Sue because while she has negative traits, she doesn't suffer consequences as a result of them nor do they actually impact the story in any meaningful way. If you write a super OP character but then give them clumsiness as their only negative character trait, then they're still a Mary Sue if the clumsiness is only used for comedic gags and never in the heat of an important battle or during a crucial moment.

The only things I can think of off the top of my head as her negative character traits is her feeling of inadequacy at the beginning, her dislike of boats/lava, as well as her naivety.

Her feelings of inadequacy are never explored much and they end up disappearing completely after she beats Bakool Ja Ja, but anyone who actually knows about these kinds of feelings knows that they don't magically go away, that just because you complete a task that you didn't think you could do, that you suddenly feel as if you're actually okay the way you are, at least these feelings don't last long-term. We never see her doubt herself after becoming Dawnservant. She does pick Koana as co-ruler but really it just comes off as "Haha, I'm big dumb cat need smart person to do thinking" which just isn't compelling when it could have come from a place of deep-seated percieved inadequacy and maybe a nagging negative feeling of "I'm not good enough for this job, even if I passed all the trials."

Her dislike of boats/vehicles and lava is literally just a comedic relief device, negative traits that are only used for comedic relief don't really count as negative traits when it comes to making a character not a Mary-Sue. I guess there's also dislike of Alpacas, but again, comedic relief, same thing.

Lastly, Wuk Lamat's naivety isn't explored at all, she doesn't suffer as a result of her overly-trusting nature, or really put her trust in someone that ends up biting her, other than maybe Sphene, but the betrayal literally just boils down to:

Sphene: "I'm gonna do the bad thing"
Wuk Lamat: "No! Don't do the bad thing!"

Again, very shallow writing, Wuk should be constantly in over her head, especially in the final zones, and constantly being out of her league should make her "imposter syndrome" manifest and make her act out in ways to overcompensate for her feeling useless. They should have done more to highlight her immaturity. Show, don't tell when it comes to writing.

Wuk Lamat also just casually never struggles in terms of combat again after beating Bakool Ja Ja, she can just tear through the fabric of reality to smack a robot and then deal 13 million damage to it in 1 hit even though days ago she couldn't even make Bakool Ja Ja flinch when she swung her axe as hard as she could. She's not the warrior of light, she shouldn't be able to overcome her limits by THAT MUCH in a few days with some feels.

Our potential is supposed to be boundless, Wuk Lamat is just a regular fem Hroth

Anyways, like I said, Wuk Lamat is a Mary Sue, she doesn't have enough negative traits to offset her positive ones, and her sudden power boost is very much unearned

[CerusSerenade]

Right, but the JP forum is also critical of her and it's a different VA so I kinda feel you're full of it. So while there maybe a tiny amount of morons spouting stuff, the VAST majority of the criticism has been aimed at the character not the VA, and the vast majority of the criticism of the VA has been about her not being good. The first to talk about her being trans was a game journo, almost as if they were trying to setup a scapegoat, trying to rile up the usual tiny contingent of clowns just so they can then try and brush away all the criticism about the poor quality of the VA and terrible terrible writing. I was here day 1 complaining about how terrible the story is, the initial posts talking about the bad VA went on for 2 days before anyone knew or mentioned the VA was trans. So again, you're full of it.

If anything that kind of substantiates what I was saying in what you directly quoted, but to address it in the fullness of my points-

Incompetence in reading and story critique is not exclusive to the U.S. believe it or not. The VA's performance itself was a small part of my initial points.

[jumps004]

I will not, especially when I have personally seen a GREAT amount of transphobia surrounding the character and her English VA. Especially now that certain figures have attached themselves to the whole thing, there is a substantial amount of people who dislike the character for no reason other than their favorite internet personality said to for transphobic or other asinine reasons.

But to come in here and wash every single point of criticism with that label adds nothing to the discussion, many in here, less than I would have liked but still, have condemned the grift being put on while still voicing a measured opinion against how the character of Wuk Lamat was portrayed or used. You can add to the discussion with the things about the character you feel were done well, when they added to the story for you, do a detailed break down instead of a reactionary mudslinging contest.

[CerusSerenade]

But to come in here and wash every single point of criticism with that label adds nothing to the discussion, many in here, less than I would have liked but still, have condemned the grift being put on while still voicing a measured opinion against how the character of Wuk Lamat was portrayed or used. You can add to the discussion with the things about the character you feel were done well, when they added to the story for you, do a detailed break down instead of a reactionary mudslinging contest.

When did I do that?

I fear your reading comprehension may be insufficient, as I applied that to a singular argument someone made, not to everyone who disliked Wuk Lamat as a whole. Re-read my post.

[NiceNox]

When did I do that?

I fear your reading comprehension may be insufficient, as I applied that to a singular argument someone made, not to everyone who disliked Wuk Lamat as a whole. Re-read my post.

I have to ask, can you post or say something without degrading one another and making you yourself look superior? Like, seriously, "Illiterate"? "Insufficient"? I do understand that you want to sound intellectual and reasonable, but there are ways in doing so without degrading others.

[CerusSerenade]

I have to ask, can you post or say something without degrading one another and making you yourself look superior? Like, seriously, "Illiterate"? "Insufficient"? I do understand that you want to sound intellectual and reasonable, but there are ways in doing so without degrading others.

People respond better to emotion than raw facts and statistics. Embarrassing them so they focus and pay attention is the best way to make sure they remember and understand what's being told to them.

Would I like to just give information out? Sure, but people insist on being dishonest, not really an effective option.