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  1. #5
    Player
    Alenore's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    439
    Character
    Alenore Llohen
    World
    Excalibur
    Main Class
    Lancer Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by honest_psycho View Post
    The problem isn't that we got all that.

    The problem is that Wuk Lamat is a textbook-case of "Mary Sue":

    - Getting the majority of the screentime and dialog, making other characters severely underdeveloped (example: Zoraal Ja's goals and motivations are mentioned in like 10 lines in total) or Gabool Ja speedrunning his redemption arc in order to not steal WukLamats spotlight.

    - getting plotarmor against Gabool Ja and half an army and taking him out, despite being fought off effortlessly before.

    - No serious characterflaws (not likeing alpacas or being seasick doesnt count, or is even more embarassing, considering she's a 6'6 buff warrior, absolute cringe)

    - She is never forced to do a morally grey decision, best example is with the red-armored HokYuj. Before they fight, some random fucking bird just attacks all of the sudden, so WukLamat can heroicly "save" her enemy and befriend them".
    Imagine what kind of interessting dilemma she could have faced, if she had to kill in self defense, but her status as spotless hero is saved by coincidence, --> no character progession.

    Textbook-case of "Mary Sue".
    A Mary Sue is a character with no meaningful flaws.

    I'm not sure we've played the same game. Wuk Lamat is shown multiple time as someone who is inadequate, but relies on other people to manage to do what's expected of her, or what she wants to do.
    - She comes seeking allies (us), and is shown as impulsive and brash ;
    - All throughout the first half of the story, she refuses to admit when she's in over her head ;
    - She's rather naive, to the point she's following a perfect stranger and gets kidnapped for her trouble ;
    - While showing some skill with a weapon, she's easily outclassed by several characters: Gulool Ja Ja, WoL, Zoraal Ja, etc ;

    I don't know about you, but an impulsive, incompetent and naive girl doesn't strike me as the perfect ruler or a mary sue.
    She grows while travelling with us, learn about her motivations, and mostly learn to rely on other people's strength. This is pretty much why Bakool Ja Ja is now with the Landsguard and she shared the Dawntrail mantle with Koana. She's not singlehandedly soloing Sphene and Zoraal Ja while we have rest.

    I suppose you mean Bakool Ja Ja's fight, in which she fills a LB bar out of nowhere multiple times, which we can most likely attribute to her resolve not to lose, save her father, and win the succession (which arguably fits the definition of how Dynamis would help).
    On that subject, from like the 2nd cutscene with Bakool, he hints that he has to win for his people. He's driven for a reason. I agree there should be consequences to releasing a literal incarnation of death upon the continent, but ehhh we've handwaved worse as Scions amirite.

    About the morally grey decision, we're literaly coming from two expansions of ancients doing pretty dubious choices being either handwaved or directly condemned. The story was meant to be more lighthearted (at least the first half lol).

    As for her screentime, this is literally an expansion about helping some girl become the Dawnservant, of course she's going to have screen time.
    What would you like for Zoraal Ja exactly, that he repeats us a 7th time that he wants "to unite everybody after they're sick of war"?

    Now, if all that is your definition of a Mary Sue, every single Scion is a Mary Sue. We always somehow find the perfect solution for everybody. We (all of us) manage to beat impossible odds.
    Did you have the feeling Thancred was a Mary Sue when he single handedly beat Ran'jit, after he kicked our ass?
    Or when we solo'd Zenos who wiped a city and us in it? Or when we kill an Ancient empowered by the memories of all those he wanted to save?
    Or when somehow, Emet Selch plot armor'd us out of the Aetherial Rift thanks to a magic crystal we apparently used without knowing?
    What meaningful flaws does WoL have?
    Or Y'shotla for that matter. if we're going with "but WoL is us so it's fine".

    If that's the reason you don't like Wuk Lamat, you probably shouldn't play this game and JRPGs because all that is pretty much the norm.
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    Last edited by Alenore; 07-05-2024 at 01:07 AM.