Bring Back Kaiten

[HikariKurosawa]

Every day people like Ryuu get baited into responding to and acknowledging the existence of creatures leading provably net-negative existence.

You okay? People are allowed to express that they don't agree with what is being posted. Sorry you're not getting the echo chamber you want. Sorry people are okay with expressing disagreement on a public forum.

If you don't have anything to add to the conversation other than personal attacks because someone is saying something that you don't like, maybe you should remove yourself from the conversation.

It's just video game mechanics, it's not that deep or personal. Get over yourself please.

[Arkdra]

I don't mind goken not being a cone anymore, but I miss fuga being a cone. The nice thing about the cone > circle alternating pattern is that sometimes cones are preferable to circles when multiple mobs decide to drop overlapping circles. Being able to get out and whip a cone safely at everything feels better than doing a circle and only hitting half the pack because you've had to dodge off somewhere suboptimal. Also, I personally find the movement of switching between cone and circle more fun than standing still. Maybe with shoha being a line again the movement aspect will return. Zanshin too to some degree but it's a 2 minute ability so not going to be that much a game-changer.

[RyuuZero]

You okay? People are allowed to express that they don't agree with what is being posted.

and I agree with this^^

I don't mind goken not being a cone anymore, but I miss fuga being a cone. The nice thing about the cone > circle alternating pattern is that sometimes cones are preferable to circles when multiple mobs decide to drop overlapping circles. Being able to get out and whip a cone safely at everything feels better than doing a circle and only hitting half the pack because you've had to dodge off somewhere suboptimal. Also, I personally find the movement of switching between cone and circle more fun than standing still. Maybe with shoha being a line again the movement aspect will return. Zanshin too to some degree but it's a 2 minute ability so not going to be that much a game-changer.

I'm fine with Fuko as a Circle, since it's a GCD AoE Weaponskill Combo Starter, you kinda auto pilot that stuff anyway. Not with Iaijutsu though and that's what annoys me about Zanshin.. it's just OG Guren but a Cone, no nuance has been added to SAM.. I see the additions of Dawntrail to SAM more like Dragoon Direction Updates applied to Samurai.. Tendo is just Highjump-styled Animation changes and Damage Boosts, Zanshin invalidates the 50 Kenki that Ikishoten gives and the ability to use the Shoha Stacks explicitly on Single Target is gone.. or in otherwords Shoha is now Geirskogul.. not a fan of those changes, but this isn't first time. we gotta see.

[HikariKurosawa]

Tendo is just Highjump-styled Animation changes and Damage Boosts, Zanshin invalidates the 50 Kenki that Ikishoten gives and the ability to use the Shoha Stacks explicitly on Single Target is gone..

It's not like that though, tendo only happens during your burst windows. Otherwise we get the original animations. It's a cool change that reflects our current state of potency and a visual indication of buff windows. Currently samurai just flows out high potency abilities and you can't really tell the difference between burst and normal aside from how fast it all comes out, now there will be a big visual contrast between burst and filler.

Zanshin justifies the 50 kenki that ikishoten gives and removes the drift factor between senei and ikishoten uses on top of ensuring less shinten spam. It is more interplay between abilities. Something players like you have been asking for, now it happens and you don't like it for some reason?

Who was using shoha stacks explicitly on single target? If shoha came up during an AoE pull and you weren't using shoha 2 you are trolling the group. AoE is how to make dungeon runs fast. Boss fights are not the important part of dungeons from an optimization perspective. Holding cooldowns for bosses or stacking power for bosses is how you get really slow dungeon runs. Like I said before, the vast majority of samurai players are celebrating this change and it is a good thing because they changed it from a radial AoE to a linear AoE. I personally don't like the linear AoE in samurai, but it's whatever at least it requires positioning and consideration. At least it fits the game and goes along with enpi and guren thematically. Did you just take shoha 2 off your bar or something?

[RyuuZero]

It's not like that though, tendo only happens during your burst windows.

So I don't just play my rotation towards to Tendo whenever I want? doesn't sound Good.

state of potency and a visual indication of buff windows.

.. like Kaiten?

Currently samurai just flows out high potency abilities and you can't really tell the difference between burst and normal aside from how fast it all comes out, now there will be a big visual contrast between burst and filler.

well.. with Kaiten you heared 4 Sword Swooshes and you knew the Next Attack hits harder is normally^^

Zanshin justifies the 50 kenki that ikishoten gives and removes the drift factor between senei and ikishoten uses on top of ensuring less shinten spam.

Not really, Ikishoten always was more like the free version of Hagakure, it just gave you Kenki to work with, to spend on Senei/Guren and those skills cost 50 Kenki originally. I'd argue with the 1min Senei/Guren it actually makes the drift even worse^^
and also back then, we had Kaiten to channel those Extra Kenki to boost our Weaponskills, not just spamming Shinten^^

It is more interplay between abilities. Something players like you have been asking for, now it happens and you don't like it for some reason?

And that's correct, which is why I want Kaiten back^^ The Interplay or Synergy of Kenki and Weaponskills is just a unmatched beauty that still hasn't been recaptured

Who was using shoha stacks explicitly on single target?

like lvl80 or Boss Fights, don't tell me that you use Shoha II in Boss Fights!!

[RyuuZero]

If shoha came up during an AoE pull and you weren't using shoha 2 you are trolling the group. AoE is how to make dungeon runs fast. Boss fights are not the important part of dungeons from an optimization perspective.

ofc you use Shoha II for Dungeon Trash Pulls but Dungeons aren't everything in this Game!

Holding cooldowns for bosses or stacking power for bosses is how you get really slow dungeon runs. Like I said before, the vast majority of samurai players are celebrating this change and it is a good thing because they changed it from a radial AoE to a linear AoE.

.. and removed the Single Option

I personally don't like the linear AoE in samurai, but it's whatever at least it requires positioning and consideration. At least it fits the game and goes along with enpi and guren thematically. Did you just take shoha 2 off your bar or something?

You act like Shoha was added in Endwalker but it was perfected with Option to apply Shoha Stacks to multiple situations.
But I have a Counterquestion: Why am I allowed to apply Kenki to Single and AoE seperately but not Shoha Stacks?
You see, the perfect Samurai can apply all their resources to the required situation.. Not just blast Cone AoEs and Line AoEs while being Single Target.. that's what Dragoons do. Are you a Dragoon?

[HikariKurosawa]

Kaiten was nothing like tendo. You used kaiten for every midare and that's all there was to it. It didn't have anything to do with raid buff windows. It was just part of the rotation. You are missing my point.

Kaiten you heard 4 sword swooshes and looked down at your fidget spinner and knew something was about to go down. Every single time you cast midare. There was no instance where you'd use it for anything else in single target. If you didn't hear the four swooshes before midare all it told you is that you misplayed. I am pretty sure I asked for the removal of kaiten because I thought the animation was gaudy.

The 1 min senei is separate from ikishoten and only costs 25 kenki. It will not make drift worse lol. Can you please think about the meaning of your statements before making them? It's clear you're posting this one based on feeling and nothing else. Now kenki is only used for oGCD damage spikes. We have 5 different attacks with kenki that's more than enough. There will always be complainers, and sure you're entitled to complain.

You already know how I feel about kaiten so it's pointless for me to beat the dead horse any further.

What do you mean like level 80 or boss fights? I said who was using shoha stacks explicitly on single target? Then you go on to say that "ofc you use shoha II for dungeon pulls".

They removed the single target option because it was button bloat for the sake of button bloat. I'll tell you what's likely to happen next too, they will remove guren and kyuten. Here's how they should do it too: senei becomes a conal aoe, shinten becomes a linear aoe.

Sam has too many buttons as is. It would be better to remove these "choices", it doesn't feel meaningful or good to press a different button to spend kenki. It's not skill, it's bloat.

[RyuuZero]

What I noticed about Dawntrail Samurai is that they oddly focussed on Meikyo Shisui..
but I gotta ask: Who wanted Tsubamegaeshi to be only accessable through Meikyo?
It's never Good to be forced into a Playstyle you severely disagree with and that point for me is the Meikyo Tsubame merge. The Main Problem about that is that I never used Meikyo in AoE Situation but I always used Tsubame in AoE.
Now I have to Meikyo -> Mangetsu -> Hagakure -> Oka (-> Guren) -> Mangetsu -> Tenka..
for an AoE Rotation that's way too convoluted because the Samurai should constantly attacking in an AoE Situation.
About Shoha.. well Shoha is now Geirskogul.. congratulations to have options and therefor control removed. It is funny since the second monster I fought in Dawntrail what I predicted to happen was.. I accidently hit something that I didn't wanted to hit. Don't get me wrong those new Shoha Effects look cool but was it worth to lose agency/control? That's the Main Reason why Samurai of Dawntrail is more like a Dynasty Warrior because in that Game you don't need to care about nuance/mastery "becoming one with the Battlefield" you just throw out attacks and kill everything. (Thank God I prepared myself for Dawntrail Samurai by playing Pirate Warrior 3 as Red Shanks! made me feel right at home) Oh and dare I remind you that The Suggestion to merge the 2 Shoha Skills was desperate plea to Bring Back Kaiten!?.. guess what they didn't do^^
But therefor we have a 1 minute Senei/Guren now, which makes you Spam less Shinten but makes you sit more on Kenki..
Though it's interesting that the removal of Kaeshi Higanbana doesn't feel as bad as I thought..
But Let's Face the persistent Problem caused by the Kaiten Removal: Kenki is irrelevant
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My Initial Questions:
Who asked for Tsubame being a follow up to Meikyo and why does Tsubame still has it's own button?
Who asked for a One Minute Senei/Guren?
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Things I would change of the Dawntrail Launch SAM:
Tsubame to be a Follow Up to Iaijutsu instead of Meikyo
reducing the Kenki Cost of Zanshin to 25 Kenki so it combos better with Senei/Guren

It is funny, I watched an Arthars Stream and the Samurai player there complaint about the casts, somebody in chat suggested to bring back Kaiten as a Swiftcast for Samurai xDD
I would add that it also should give Direct Hit though^^ and with the old requirements like 20 Kenki and that's the first Kenki skill at lvl52

[A_moth_called_rose]

Man I still miss kaiten. I miss my cool flippy katana flourish right into midare setsugekka. the new stuff just doesn't FEEL the same

[RyuuZero]

Last Post I forgot to also mention the overall Good Stuff they added to SAM in Dawntrail:
Tengentsu seriously who thinks that Tengentsu is Bad needs to be checked since it really feels soo Good!! even though the delay of the self heal is a bit weird but I'd say that's a nitpick (until the Serious Endgame Raider Samurai rages about it.. or something).
And Yeah that New Tendo stuff also looks cool.. (still would be funny if NIN would've gotten Tendo) HAH! xD

as for the concerning/Bad Part.. I'd say the focus on Meikyo is something to think about.. I mean.. seriously? We're lvl100 Samurai and we focus on a lvl50 Skill all the sudden? Not helped by the fact that Tsubame is now locked behind Meikyo which just feels clunky!!! and Tendo?? Why not make it that Meikyo only gives Tendo and Tsubame being the Follow Up to Iaijutsu? Also an Interesting thing that I noticed that the Kaeshi Higanbana removal doesn't feel as Bad as I thought^^
the 1min Guren/Senei may reduce the Shinten Spam but doesn't change the Fact that Kenki is just a replacable Burst Resource and now even worse but with the 1min Senei/Guren you rather icentificed to sit on Kenki so you can better line up Senei/Guren within your 2mins.. yay and Zanshin? does literally nothing! you could remove Ikishoten's 50 Kenki and replace it with "Zanshin Ready" and the outcome would be the same where I still have to ask the Question: Why is the Synergy of Kenki and Weaponskills Bad?
also.. Gyofu.. why? who asked for Gyofu and why doesn't it give 10 Kenki like Fuko????

Just tested it.. Tendo is just a Potency Increase... So Direct Hit Kaiten LET'S GOOOO