Thank you for the Astro changes coming in dawntrail!

[Aelin_Ashryver]

I'm really happy about the changes coming to Astrologian so thank you. Astro has been asking for many problems to be solved about the job, some of which were big problems pre-shadowbringers! Finally it has happened!

-Astrodyne's buffs and cd misalignment throughout an encounter

-Seals being a replacement for cards all doing the same exact thing

- DPS cards always being superior than utility cards

- Astro's pain point of healing mechanics happening during the 2min burst and having "dead windows" where we aren't using card OGCD's outside of burst windows

-Replacing/removing thoughtless action bloat with meaningful actions

-Lord/lady being held and not being able to see it's cooldown



Honestly all REALLY wonderful changes. Senix looked at the problems with Astrologian in Endwalker and in previous expansions and decided to tackle all of them! So honestly, thank you for that. As someone who has mained every iteration of Ast ever, I really appreciate this direction.

That being said, I have only a few concerns. One of which is that card manipulation is now seemingly completely gone. Card manipulation has always been a fun part about astrologian. I think it's a big part of what many of us enjoyed about HW/SB astrologian. Just being able to cycle your cards, redraw your cards, change your cards into a buff for other cards, or change your cards into a lord/lady. Any type of card manipulation that we had is now gone. It was pretty much dead in endwalker with redraw being our only option, but I still think it will be missed and I hope it returns in a future expansion in some way.

My only other concern, with the information we have so far, is that our cards might be a little bit too generic. One dps buff, one heal (hot or instant), one mitigation (damage reduction). Those are all great, but they don't have any flavor to them. So what I mean is that in any game, a buff that shoots missiles or debuffs targets that you attack while the buff is active will always be more fun than a button that just does +x% damage. -x% damage taken. If the new offensive card, and new mitigation card are too simple in such a way, then I think we should consider spicing them up for 8.x

100% agree. I love this new iteration I feel if they can add some card manipulation back and make sure cards are interesting I'd be loving it. It'd be cool if we could one day get more cards (not likely ik) and randomise the draw, so still get 1 dmg 1 mit 1 utility but it draws from a pool of 3-4 affects each time and we can manipulate a chosen card from there. Make draw unusable outside of combat to stop people fishing for the 'best' card so parse monkeys can't ruin AST again like they did to SB AST with their whining of long prepull times. Even if we don't get the rng back into our cards I like this a hell of a lot better than every card being damage.

[PercibelTheren]

I'm happy for you, OP. I'm genuinely glad to see there are actually people who like the changes and that means the job won't die completely, even though it's dead to many of us. It was the only healer I enjoyed playing, I guess I'll be picking up Dancer in DT, if I even stick around for it at all.

[Aelin_Ashryver]

If this was a problem for you, skill issue.



Now they aren't cards at all. Congrats on your aetherflow. Cards are drawn from a deck, not set out in advance.



Solved in shadowbringers, had room to grow, but instead they decided to appease people who don't even like the job.

I love the job, I hate the state it has been in for EW but I still love the job. And now it's returning to something closer to what first drew me to the job I am thrilled.

I'd argue they killed AST's flavour in SHB and it was barely clinging on thanks to sleeve draw and redraw. If SHB is what you loved most then I'd argue you and other's like you are the one's they changed AST for who "don't even like the job". They didn't like how random SB AST was, they didn't like sitting to get their prepull balance for their parse (nothing was forcing you to do that) and so SE made it boring and did away with everything that was fun for me in SB about ast. Different cards you could adapt too and ways to maniulate them, it was great and far and away my most beloved healer. SHB was horrible but I had fun being oprah throwing out cards left and right till EW they chose to remove that as well and lump us with astrodyne. Because yes that's what I want to do buff myself... a healer.. riiight.

This is far better than all cards being the same, if they can add some card manipulation back and a little of the rng it's perfect (not likely but hopefully). I never want our cards to just be damage. You nor any others who share your opinion and belittle others for theirs can say those of us commenting don't like the job. We've been invested in the job ourselves, possibly even longer than you.

You can sit the next 2+ years and see how it was for those of us who were bored to tears by all cards being damage I guess. I'll be having fun once DT drops! Hoping to get the manipulation and a little rng put back in for 8.0, if not that maybe some more time manipulation mechanics, that'd be cool!

[Kissune]

I love the job, I hate the state it has been in for EW but I still love the job. And now it's returning to something closer to what first drew me to the job I am thrilled.

I'd argue they killed AST's flavour in SHB and it was barely clinging on thanks to sleeve draw and redraw. If SHB is what you loved most then I'd argue you and other's like you are the one's they changed AST for who "don't even like the job". They didn't like how random SB AST was, they didn't like sitting to get their prepull balance for their parse (nothing was forcing you to do that) and so SE made it boring and did away with everything that was fun for me in SB about ast. Different cards you could adapt too and ways to maniulate them, it was great and far and away my most beloved healer. SHB was horrible but I had fun being oprah throwing out cards left and right till EW they chose to remove that as well and lump us with astrodyne. Because yes that's what I want to do buff myself... a healer.. riiight.

This is far better than all cards being the same, if they can add some card manipulation back and a little of the rng it's perfect (not likely but hopefully). I never want our cards to just be damage. You nor any others who share your opinion and belittle others for theirs can say those of us commenting don't like the job. We've been invested in the job ourselves, possibly even longer than you.

You can sit the next 2+ years and see how it was for those of us who were bored to tears by all cards being damage I guess. I'll be having fun once DT drops! Hoping to get the manipulation and a little rng put back in for 8.0, if not that maybe some more time manipulation mechanics, that'd be cool!

Sooo... you're mad that they got rid of RNG utility cards in ShB... Your favourite part of StB AST was the different cards you could adapt to and manipulate... But you're happy that RNG cards are going away entirely? Aaaand you think having zero RNG, zero manipulation, and zero thought isn't going to 'bore you to tears?' All of this to 'own the ShB/EW ast mains'? I mean, you do you, I guess, but if this rework is drawing you back to the game I think you might have just wanted to play scholar instead since what we're getting is closer to aetherflow than anything pre-ShB. Cards aren't all damage sure, because they aren't cards anymore. The only thing they have in common with anything resembling the cards from HW to EW is a name and a visual. I would have been more fine with stormblood cards being added back in their entirety than this, but you can go ahead and argue that I'm wrong for wanting to have to think about what I'm doing and adapt rather than playing the exact same cards in the exact same spots with the exact same effects every single pull. And yes, even EW cards had variance to them. You might not like them being 'all damage' but AST having the highest gap between highest and lowest dps shows that there's a substantial difference between an AST who thinks, and one who doesn't. 'Oh but there's only melee and ranged and seals don't matter bc dyne is a dps buff' yeah keep repeating that in your head when it turns out that the two mitigation cards are just a 300 potency shield and a flat 15% mit and you have to convince yourself that these matter in any fundamental way. So I hope you enjoy your starry white mage, and I'll see you here in 7.1 complaining with me that cards aren't interesting enough bc I can assure you, if stormblood cards are what you wanted, they ain't here. Enjoy pressing the same 4 buttons that do the same thing at the same time to the same people, though, I'm sure you'll be absolutely fascinated by all the new options you have like... ED 2, Exalt 2, Intersection 2... And all the different ways to interact with them, like playing them! Wow! Innovative! No other healer just plays single target healing spells or mit spells, wow! But it's okay guys, it's different, because this time... They have different VFX and can only be used every other minute, but are used for the exact same thing bc it actually doesn't matter the effects if you don't have a choice in which one you use! Isn't that amazing?

Just stop. Nobody cares that you're upset about it anymore because all you do it put everyone else down when they disagree with you. You also just ignore what Aelin said completely. They clearly even state they want manipulation back and yet you throw "you're happy theres no manipulation anymore?!" If you can't even do the bare minimum of reading what other people write then just stop posting. You're just writing novels to jam your opinion down everyone else's throat

They say the want RNG back, insult me for wanting RNG back, blame me for RNG being gone when I want it back, and claim the job is better now with even less RNG than it's ever had and with no identity in common with StB beyond 'well I mean the buttons that do stuff kinda look like cards with nothing else in common, so close enough' so what am I supposed to reply with? It seems like you guys don't even know what you want. You want AST to be what, unique? Interesting? Challenging? Intuitive? Related in any way to drawing cards and mastering it with what you get? Then why are you praising the single greatest dumbing down of the job in its history all bc you get to press a single target mit every 60s that looks like bole?

[Supersnow845]

Let’s ignore the “RNG vs no RNG” argument for a second and think of AST’s playstyle on a minute to minute basis with these changes

You will now draw 4 cards. A damage up card, a healing card (we aren’t sure if it’s a direct heal or a healing potency up) and a mitigation card plus either lord or lady

So now rather than getting to buff someone once every 30 seconds on average you now get one buff card per minute which means that since you now no longer overlap cards you will functionally always put that card on the same person every time (the melee that is getting DP’ed and fed gear) so all buff decision making is gone. The heal and the mitigation card are just another in a long line of AST’s overpowered single target heals they don’t need alongside 3 charges of ED, 2 charges of CI and exaltation. I also imagine the healing card is unlikely to be healing up as square enix has been really trying to avoid targeted single target healing up buffs because of the spreadlo problem recently

I for one didn’t like how hectic the burst was in EW because of the bad decision on the second charge of draw but this just seems to rip out the actual fantasy of buffing, divination is still a boring flat 6% and now you get 1 buff per minute and 1 damage oGCD every 2 minutes in lord

RNG or no RNG this seems to go against the buffing class fantasy specifically because healing and mitigation aren’t really buffs, they are just generic healer CD’s all healers are drowning in. If you want healing up as a buff SCH is already the king of healing up buffs and SGE is the king of mitigation you can force onto an unruly tank

It just seems to leave AST with nothing

[Zolvolt]

Sooo... you're mad that they got rid of RNG utility cards in ShB... Your favourite part of StB AST was the different cards you could adapt to and manipulate... But you're happy that RNG cards are going away entirely? Aaaand you think having zero RNG, zero manipulation, and zero thought isn't going to 'bore you to tears?' All of this to 'own the ShB/EW ast mains'? I mean, you do you, I guess, but if this rework is drawing you back to the game I think you might have just wanted to play scholar instead since what we're getting is closer to aetherflow than anything pre-ShB. Cards aren't all damage sure, because they aren't cards anymore. The only thing they have in common with anything resembling the cards from HW to EW is a name and a visual. I would have been more fine with stormblood cards being added back in their entirety than this, but you can go ahead and argue that I'm wrong for wanting to have to think about what I'm doing and adapt rather than playing the exact same cards in the exact same spots with the exact same effects every single pull. And yes, even EW cards had variance to them. You might not like them being 'all damage' but AST having the highest gap between highest and lowest dps shows that there's a substantial difference between an AST who thinks, and one who doesn't. 'Oh but there's only melee and ranged and seals don't matter bc dyne is a dps buff' yeah keep repeating that in your head when it turns out that the two mitigation cards are just a 300 potency shield and a flat 15% mit and you have to convince yourself that these matter in any fundamental way. So I hope you enjoy your starry white mage, and I'll see you here in 7.1 complaining with me that cards aren't interesting enough bc I can assure you, if stormblood cards are what you wanted, they ain't here. Enjoy pressing the same 4 buttons that do the same thing at the same time to the same people, though, I'm sure you'll be absolutely fascinated by all the new options you have like... ED 2, Exalt 2, Intersection 2... And all the different ways to interact with them, like playing them! Wow! Innovative! No other healer just plays single target healing spells or mit spells, wow! But it's okay guys, it's different, because this time... They have different VFX and can only be used every other minute, but are used for the exact same thing bc it actually doesn't matter the effects if you don't have a choice in which one you use! Isn't that amazing?

Just stop. Nobody cares that you're upset about it anymore because all you do it put everyone else down when they disagree with you. You also just ignore what Aelin said completely. They clearly even state they want manipulation back and yet you throw "you're happy theres no manipulation anymore?!" If you can't even do the bare minimum of reading what other people write then just stop posting. You're just writing novels to jam your opinion down everyone else's throat

[Rithy255]

Sadly I feel like this is actually common, I think Astro will be more popular meaning it will be stuck like this. Which honestly isn't great.

I complained about Ast changes (not on the forum) and all i got was "RNG was bad ect."

It misses the entire identity of Astro, If I wanted to play white mage I would play White mage, The card system while not as complex as it was in "stormblood ast" was at least High apm for bursts and allowed some thinking of who to put your card on.

Now it's literally just a clunkier Aetherflow, that you spent one on the buff, One's tied to lord/lady which isn't likely rng either, Ones a mitigation and another is a heal (because astro really needs more healing!!!)

It's really like no one on the dev team played astro, I have to sit here see PLD get ruined my fav tank now Astro is getting ruined, guess I'll just enjoy the 30 minute queue times because no one wants to play support jobs as they're beyond boring and samey at this point.

[Heilstos]

I have to say that the cards are a little more than Etherflowstacks. I have to say that those were the cards now. In every 2 minute window, thanks to energydran (100 DP xD).

So Astrodyne could have been an update of Lightspeed. I'm happy to agree. But no Melee and Ranged cards was a good step and no seals.

I like the idea that there are now definable cards available. I'm already dreaming about Exaltation + def card.

I see the tactical use according to Yoshi P. However, I'm waiting for the tool tips. As long as I'm happy to be there to dry the tears of the AST, who only wanted the 3 DPS cards and had more stress than just playing WHM. I'm so excited that the AST will be more in the middle of the community again.

I felt the same way when they destroyed the SB AST Card system. I see the pain of the players. However, you shouldn't be sad until you have seen the final tool tips.

It's really like no one on the dev team played astro, I have to sit here see PLD get ruined my fav tank now Astro is getting ruined, guess I'll just enjoy the 30 minute queue times because no one wants to play support jobs as they're beyond boring and samey at this point.

If you want I can also play AST for you in DT. I would do it with pleasure. =)

[Zaytex]

The casual players thematically love the idea of each card having a different use card, even if SB era made it apparent only the DPS increase card was viable in content that had any meaning.

AST rework is purely down to catering for casuals, which makes sense given they're the biggest source of income for the game.

[KanataNanaya]

Let’s ignore the “RNG vs no RNG” argument for a second and think of AST’s playstyle on a minute to minute basis with these changes

You will now draw 4 cards. A damage up card, a healing card (we aren’t sure if it’s a direct heal or a healing potency up) and a mitigation card plus either lord or lady

So now rather than getting to buff someone once every 30 seconds on average you now get one buff card per minute which means that since you now no longer overlap cards you will functionally always put that card on the same person every time (the melee that is getting DP’ed and fed gear) so all buff decision making is gone. The heal and the mitigation card are just another in a long line of AST’s overpowered single target heals they don’t need alongside 3 charges of ED, 2 charges of CI and exaltation. I also imagine the healing card is unlikely to be healing up as square enix has been really trying to avoid targeted single target healing up buffs because of the spreadlo problem recently

I for one didn’t like how hectic the burst was in EW because of the bad decision on the second charge of draw but this just seems to rip out the actual fantasy of buffing, divination is still a boring flat 6% and now you get 1 buff per minute and 1 damage oGCD every 2 minutes in lord

RNG or no RNG this seems to go against the buffing class fantasy specifically because healing and mitigation aren’t really buffs, they are just generic healer CD’s all healers are drowning in. If you want healing up as a buff SCH is already the king of healing up buffs and SGE is the king of mitigation you can force onto an unruly tank

It just seems to leave AST with nothing

I'm sorry but that's you assuming people want to play correctly.

It's gonna be malefic malefic benefic malefic ohhhhh draw is up, you get a card you get a card, malefic malefic ohhh draw is up 30 seconds ago.

that is assuming people are even doing ABC, Always Be Casting. which they wont.

That's the state of the demographic yoshi P is catering to.

If he said something like "we will watch out for feedback" and adjust then i would have copium.
but the literal japanese phrase he used was "please understand" meaning that they have completely gave up and expect most people to wait for 8.0