New dawntrial job changes are underwhelming and im not excited

[WaxSw]

Personally it made me more excited for 8.0. It's looking like a fire xpac if they'll remove all the post Shb shitty job design

[sindriiisgaming]

They Did listen TO MUCH on other Fronts. Take PvP for example. The people who do not even play pvp complained it is to hard back in the Day and now we have a shallow 5 skill spam and run mode. If you do not die from Chain Vacuum Cleaner + Dragoon Combos, you die from boredom.

better than shb pvp where it was mch vs you you will just die now

[Moqi]

Incredibly underwheling. Not only it's more of the same, but in the name of "streamlining" they are completely killing entire playstyles. Why can't we even have ONE job that is all about DoT/buff upkeep, or about positionals. And now they're giving every healer wings because not happy to homogenize mechanics, they have started homogenizing aesthetics too.

You want us to play only one way? Fine by me, I actually prefer it over talent trees and specs. But at least give us variety in that! Every job should feel different but with every expansion the lines are blurred more and more.


And no, more variety in fight mechanics cannot compensate for the lack of interesting job mechanics, because 90% of this game is still going to be braindead, so any interesting stuff will be relegated to Ultimate and Savage, so anything outside of that will have boring fights on top of boring jobs. And when they focus on job identity in 8.0 (as if), what will happen to the interesting fight mechanics of 7.0? Can't have them anymore because jobs are complex now?

[Menriq]

what we needed wasn't another skill on top of every other skill to do more damage. what we needed was a job design overhaul and rework of job identity. this has not only been lost so far, but in dt will be even further lost as healers homogenise even more. whm becomes a sage with wings, sch now has enshroud and every finisher just gets a new finisher.

its to late now for DT.. this is what we have and it wont be changed in time. so we can only hope 8.0 will make the notable changes the game needs.

talking mainly about the removal of dps checks on bosses.
lets talk about why those dps checks are an issue
they limit the amount of playstyles you can run with because everything needs to be about damage.
this creates meta damage builds that eliminate all creative pathing from jobs forcing your rotation to make you feel like a mindless zombie in pve just hitting the same buttons over and over. the players are sick of this, and the game feels like your in a half asleep trance not really playing just.. doing it.

jobs should perhaps go down skill tree paths, allowing people to customize HOW we play the job. this is something i like in wow (i dont play it but i was my bf build specs on it) obv i dont want to build healer tanks, but why not be able to build tanks that can mitigate more damage, do more damage, or heal party members. if you remove the dps checks from fights, then people will be able to make there job without fear of being penalized.

perhaps adding variables to fights, like for example this week the boss does increased aoe damage, or this week healing potency is reduced. these are just raw ideas. but doing this could already allow for some customization of your jobs. it saddens me that this company is made up of experienced game designers who cannot program a good combat system.. maybe 3.0 really WAS better

First, you can not remove DPS checks. If you have no DPS checks, then you don't need DPS classes since you can just bring tank and healers and just power through any content in the game.

Second, you brought up WoW. They have different specs, and different talent trees. There are constant complaints there about the imbalance of the classes and specs. This kind of thing is a pick your poison type of situation where there are pros and cons to how you do this. On the same vein, if you think WoW doesn't have meta builds, then you might need to look into this further. You have M+ builds, raid builds, PvP builds, etc., but each of them have their own meta. Just like here, if you aren't doing high end content, then it's certainly not an issue what build you go with. However, if the theme of what the high end players does trickles down, then you are really just looking at an illusion of choice.

I certainly understand a lot of the concerns of what was shown, but I also remember how SCH was getting absolutely memed on for the Expedient changes, and then ended up having to be nerfed because of how powerful it was. As a software developer, I can kind of see their long term plan. Instead of trying to make huge changes all over the place, they are going with an iterative approach. Assuming they follow through with what they said in changing up the encounters in 7.x, the next big change to build off that would be the 8.x series where they can hopefully go back to not being so homogenized and let classes be a lot more distinct.

[sdr26]

Before I came to FFXIV, I played SWTOR and each class had 2-3 specs or skill trees. I would like each job to have a dot spec and a burst spec per SE. The problem that SWTOR had was balancing the specs incorrectly and making players to be on a spec that they are uncomfortable with in some fights. If they were to implement something similar, they need to be careful about balancing DPS numbers while giving players the freedom to play how they want.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

yea but why, saying its bad and not saying why isnt exactly helpful

With talent trees, you either have well balanced ones, which at that point, are just new jobs. Or you have imbalanced ones, at which point, why have them at all.

There is always a wrong choice in a talent tree. They are not equal choices.

[Acelyn]

Before I came to FFXIV, I played SWTOR and each class had 2-3 specs or skill trees. I would like each job to have a dot spec and a burst spec per SE. The problem that SWTOR had was balancing the specs incorrectly and making players to be on a spec that they are uncomfortable with in some fights. If they were to implement something similar, they need to be careful about balancing DPS numbers while giving players the freedom to play how they want.

lol, your own post pretty much sums up why ff14 is built the way it is, because like swtor they wouldnt be able to balance the classes.

ff14 will never get a full job overhaul, that wont happen until another ff mmo is created from scratch.

[Rithy255]

Can't believe im saying this but i wish we had Endwalker design back now looking at the DT changes.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

Can't believe im saying this but i wish we had Endwalker design back now looking at the DT changes.

Nah, new mnk looks great. And here I thought I was going to be swapping back to DRG for dawntrail.

[EverQuest]

Agree but the more you all simp for this that’s what’s you’ll get expansion after expansion.

WOW expansions generally suck as well but at least they take more risk. SE is extremely risk adverse.