Can we have the hellhound gearset available to buy with Trophy Crystals?

[Doozer]

For those that knew how to MMO pvp it was a matter of being better than the opponent and improving what they could do.

Breaking News: PvP is about trying to win and also making your opponent lose.

[Boa-Noah]

I am done with having my words and suggestions to improve PvP as a whole twisted by people who hate PvP in the first place and have zero understanding of how incentives and lack-thereof work.

There is no twisting here, you want a system that prioritizes ranked involvement to get old Feast gear and I'm straight up saying that's not the solution you seem to think it is, if people wanted to play ranked then ranked would be more popular, sorry not sorry, but there's a reason the game mode you love isn't exactly drawing in crowds and that needs to be fixed first. My dislike of PVP does not mean I have 0 understanding of PVP nor have I done PVP, I dip into casual all the time if I want something for a glam from the crystal vendors, I read reddit, I check the forums from time to time, I'm not some blind idiot that has no concept of PVP just because I don't enjoy it and don't play it actively.

The point being that forcing people into ranked is NOT going to improve ranked, it's not going to diversify the challenge, it's not going to make the devs suddenly start caring for ranked and giving it fresh new exciting rewards because that system DIDN'T WORK!

That was Feast, for a lot of folks Feast was literally being forced into ranked because they wanted the gear, hence the win traders and people buying their spot in the top 100, hell people could claim multiple spots of that top 100 by themselves, it was not a fun innovative experience and the fact it's literally not part of the game anymore speaks volumes more than I ever could. Adding old Feast rewards to the current PVP system doesn't disincentivize ranked anymore than it already is, pretending otherwise is silly, if people wanted to play ranked PVP then they'd PROBABLY be playing it and it wouldn't have been put into the state it is currently. Again, and this has to be stressed, if Feast wasn't an awful system that people hated it would still be here, if people loved playing ranked PVP then there'd be rewards for it, that's the simple honest truth that seems to be completely ignored here in some desperate attempt to leverage age old unavailable glamor pieces to make people begrudgingly go in, lose, rinse repeat until they have enough currency to stop doing it.

Casual PVP as it is has people that just stand there waiting for the game to end because they don't care about PVP, I'm not endorsing that behavior but do you really think forcing those people to do ranked will change anything for ranked?

It sucks when the game mode you love isn't popular, it's fine, I understand, but don't pretend that your solution is going to provide rankers any kind of serious competition.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

That's literally a ranked acquisition though...

I mean no system within playing ranked matches outside of just being top 100. There's no win x matches, attempt x matches, kill x players.

It only incentivizes being top 100. Which, per server maybe is t so bad, or wasn't back then. But it was per DC. And now? Would be impossible for most players. You're more likely to clear ultimate as a casual than get top 100.

(this part below isn't direct at you)
The problem with ranked is there is no incentive to use ranked outside of aiming for top 100 in a system like this. So anyone who looked at it because of a mount, like one of my friends when the dreadnought was added (why SE did you add so many damn coil bosses to pvp as mounts), saw that he needed to be top 100 to get it, and promptly gave up.

My guess is this was a common thing for non-pvpers, who may have been interested in trying, saw the requirement was impossible for them, and promptly didn't even bother trying.

This makes ranked queues worse, because people who may be casually interested now just won't queue.

If you want more people in ranked, you need to make the rewards accessible. Otherwise, the only people who will play are the ones already invested in it because they like competitive pvp.

[Chasingstars]

I personally would be fine with old ranked stuff being purchasable with trophy crystals, also trophy crystals should really have an increased capacity more than 20,000. As there really should be more items for purchase for trophy crystals in general. Also rival wings really should have duty roulette available to it.

[Boa-Noah]

If you want more people in ranked, you need to make the rewards accessible. Otherwise, the only people who will play are the ones already invested in it because they like competitive pvp.

Yes, but introducing a brand new system on top of the current PVP system that prioritizes ranked isn't going to do that, give ranked more points per round in the current system and people will probably dabble and maybe enjoy it, forcing them into it as the only way to get glam from years ago is not (in my opinion) the solution to the problem facing ranked.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

Yes, but introducing a brand new system on top of the current PVP system that prioritizes ranked isn't going to do that, give ranked more points per round in the current system and people will probably dabble and maybe enjoy it, forcing them into it as the only way to get glam from years ago is not (in my opinion) the solution to the problem facing ranked.

Oh I agree. I think they need to just put them in for wolf collars or something. It's been long enough.

[Stechun]

I definitely think there's something to be said for recirculating old pvp rewards, regardless of past official statements. At least in the scope of post-Endwalker pvp I seriously hope we'll see old series rewards return soon since there are some fundamentally useful and fun emotes for rp or just expressing your character in general that were tied to past 6.X series, it would be a shameful waste to not re-release those in the trophy shop, or possibly even through other recurring means like Itinerant Moogle events, if those had a consistent lineup of old pvp series rewards at a marked up moogle tome price I think that would be a great way to let both pvp and non pvp players have access to those rewards through gameplay.

[Nezerius]

Yes, but introducing a brand new system on top of the current PVP system that prioritizes ranked isn't going to do that, give ranked more points per round in the current system and people will probably dabble and maybe enjoy it, forcing them into it as the only way to get glam from years ago is not (in my opinion) the solution to the problem facing ranked.

Except there's definitely ways of tying these rewards to ranked matches while making them more accessible, and even give people enough incentive to try it out without the pressure of "top 100 or bust".

-Add a Crystal Coin currency as a reward for finishing a season at Crystal rank.
-Add a Silver Coin currency as a reward for finishing a season at Silver, Gold, Platinum, or Diamond rank. Coin reward based on the tier (2 at Silver/4 at Gold/6 at Platinum/8 at Crystal)
-Add a vendor with every single top 100 reward available, each reward costing a single Crystal Coin. The vendor will also allow players to trade in 10 Silver Coins for a single Crystal Coin.
-Similar to the old Feast seasons, add new rewards to this vendor with every new CC season. This would generally be a new model every other season, with a recolour in between.

Purposefully leaving Bronze rank out because the bar would be set too low otherwise.

This will allow the more dedicated PvP players (the ones who will generally reach Crystal) to obtain these rewards at roughly the same pace as the old Feast seasons.
Meanwhile, someone only reaching Silver would take 5 CC seasons to be able to purchase 1 rewards. While this will definitely reduce the exclusivity of some of the rewards, needing almost half an expansion worth of seasond to obtain a single reward would prevent these rewards from flooding into the game.

There you go, incentive to queue up for ranked matches (obtaining rewards eventually), with extra incentive (getting rewards faster) for those who can climb to Crystal.

[Stechun]

As for any of the pre-Endwalker pvp rewards, I'll bluntly admit I don't think that Square Enix ever should have provided rewards beyond basic trophies and medals for any ranked modes, I say this as someone who can usually get some satisfaction and validation from climbing a competitive bracket in a multiplayer game, I can't take FFXIV's pvp seriously in a competitive sense because there's a couple glaring problems with it, at least from my perspective. First of which being that I, as an player from the US playing on one of the North American data centers, ALWAYS have to play with 100 ping due to the strict geographic location of Square Enix's servers. Having any sort of rank tied to my gameplay feels beyond frustrating whenever split second interactions can feel completely unpredictable due to that issue alone, and that's not even taking to account that even with good ping FFXIV has an usually long feeling delay between client and server interactions.

And secondly and most importantly nowadays is just that there has and always will be cheaters, it's just a fact at this point that no matter what DC you are on, that if you have played pvp for any decent amount of time you absolutely have run into people using external software to gain an advantage, especially in ranked modes. Even if you couldn't possibly realize it, it is very accessible to anyone on pc who is intent on doing it and has been around for years. It's not just a matter of something obvious like people one-shotting you or hitting some button that instantly wins them the game, but rather they have access to information on all their opponents and can keep tabs on their cooldowns, as well as having combat cheats like an auto-target that can shut down anyone who might use a limit break or disadvantageous ability on them.

I don't blame Square Enix by any means, and I'm glad and prefer FFXIV to exist without any sort of invasive anti-cheat software, but it calls into question the validity some of these past ranked rewards that have actually appealing and sought after glamours and mounts, if they re-released those old feast rewards in any capacity it would objectively suck for a lot of the people who did legitimately acquire those rewards, but as long as they retain some identifier that marks them as having acquired it through those legitimate means, I would hope they would be okay with players who never had the chance to acquire those mounts and glamour the opportunity to do so, since I think one of the best aspects of FFXIV is the accessibility for people being able to set goals for themselves without having felt like they completely missed out by not playing at a specific place and time.

[Reinhardt_Azureheim]

This is hopefully my final post adressing some of the things you said, my apologies for the massive wall for any reader involved.

-1st paragraph-

Yes I am suggesting a system that prioritizes ranked involvement because it is, along with Rival Wings (for a different reason), a mode that actually needs it.

And honestly, spare me your commentary. All you do is keep parroting "if people wanted to play ranked then ranked would be more popular [...] there's a reason the game mode you love isn't exactly drawing in crowds and that needs to be fixed first" yet in your infinite wisdom you do not provide "a reason" while I do. Have you actually compared it to casual and why casual is popular? Hint - it has nothing to do with the gamemode itself.

Both have:

• The exact same job selection and stats
• The exact same maps and mechanics
• The exact same ruleset
• The exact same base rewards except for Diamond+ Commendation Crystals and the incredibly mid carbon-copy Framer kits

What they differ in:

• One restricts you to play within a skill range depending on your skill tier, the other does not
• One actually has people trying harder and compete seriously, the other does not

Crystalline Conflict Casual Mode is very active in all regions and is generally well received + very accessible. Ranked plays by the exact same rulesets minus the grouping range, a different duty queue and no meaningful incentive to queue and populate it. I am not going to debate this, these points are factually in the game. You have to be blind or willfully ignorant to not understand the difference and the problems at this point.

And I am glad for you that you actually do know a bit about PvP, but frankly you keep proving the point - you say you dip into casual and basically come in for the casual rewards. You have yet to convince me that you have any understanding about the issues Ranked PvPers are going through, let alone that you care. I am not asking you to know it all, but I am asking you to let those that understand and care have their share.

-2nd paragraph about "feast bad" and "ranked bad"-

For the entire "feast was hated, it did not work, if people wanted to play ranked they'd still have rewards", please refer to this table first.



Feast's issue was there was basically no way to play it other than ranked, because the accessibility was terrible. The ranked leaderboards had issues too, I do not deny that, especially on the multiple characters per service account ranking there. Feast as a mode was not terrible though and ranked players + holy trinity enthusiasts fondly remember it. The reason Feast got replaced by Crystalline Conflict was the fundamental issues it had with the gamemode, namely the ruleset and unintuitive gameplay design.

You claim it will not work. However, we have never had a single moment where both mode accessibility and incentive were actually at a good standing at the same time, which I am advocating for.

There is however a few extra points that have yet to be addressed. For one, in JP the system works - because JP does duties "because they exist to do". Their entire community behaviour is vastly different from ours, from how they see Savage and Ultimate duties to marketboard/gilmarking, handling raids and also PvP. For them content that exists should be done. Because of this, those that enjoy ranked still can do ranked.

We are not Japan. We are the reward-driven western playerbase and we have been complaining about a lack of rewards for virtually everything when it was inadequate. But select individuals will make hypocritical exceptions for PvP for some odd reason.

"if people loved playing ranked PVP then there'd be rewards for it" - this is vile because you are essentially blaming us for not loving ranked PvP enough when we played it when we actually did. It was a design idea the developers pushed with the Battlepass + the current ranked reward structure that got us here. The battlepass and trophy crystal shop are fantastic ideas, even if there are some flaws. The ranked rewards are dogshit. They don't even provide extensive adventurerplate elements like Ultimates do, not even Rank. They stick out like a sore thumb and if you had one full set, you no longer have a reason to get more i.e. play more, spiralling the queue times up.

Yes, adding new rewards to the "current pvp system" i.e. Trophy Crystals / Wolfmarks will not desincentivize ranked, because ranked is starved to death already lacking meaningful rewards obtainable for various skill tiers.


Not sure how much more obvious I can make it for you how much of an issue western Ranked has.

Casual PVP as it is has people that just stand there waiting for the game to end because they don't care about PVP, I'm not endorsing that behavior but do you really think forcing those people to do ranked will change anything for ranked?

It sucks when the game mode you love isn't popular, it's fine, I understand, but don't pretend that your solution is going to provide rankers any kind of serious competition.

You are talking about a completely different demographic here and perhaps this is an NA server issue, who knows. The people you are talking about are the reason why losing shouldn't give as much battlepass EXP as it does (700 vs 900) in the first place. The thing I suggested, multiple times (did you even care?), would not work with "lol let's lose to get stuff", you'd still need to win to get things over time. The difference is that you'd instead even be able to do it at bronze level. And who says you'd stop at bronze? Natural progression means you'd get better and better and reach higher tiers - because you actually get to play.


Six servers I am part of, full of people who want to do PvP but have to bide their time and organize active queue dates so people can actually compete against each other. And that's just what I have in my list, in EU, both Chaos and Light. We even organize 5v5 light party scrims. And it isn't just Crystal players, we have complete newbies across the board who play with us and enjoy it.

Maybe my solution is not the final one that will heal it, but at least I am here making suggestions to improve what needs improving and offer solutions that benefit more than one party rather than be a stick in the mud, make claims with no precedent or logical connection and say "no" to virtually everything because I hate what others like.