Why Black Mage is the best designed job and what can be learned from it

[Supersnow845]

It only means that they are not afraid to shake things up when push comes to shove. Again, like what I said in my previous post, I think in this thread (too lazy to backread), some voices are heard more than others. Their vision on how a job will be designed was implemented.



Pure speculation. We don't have proof that they don't care. Sure we can say that they do and you might even be correct. But again, given that they did make some drastic changes says otherwise.

What push came to shove anything about pre 6.3 PLD, everyone adored it, it was just a little too weak on the damage side, then instead of actually buffing its DPS while maintaining its design they just made it a diet GNB

[rawker]

What push came to shove anything about pre 6.3 PLD, everyone adored it, it was just a little too weak on the damage side, then instead of actually buffing its DPS while maintaining its design they just made it a diet GNB

I remember back during HW in one of their live letters. They acknowledged the overwhelmingly negative responses to PLD sucking so bad (blocks only affecting Physical damage when raid tiers are mostly magical because DRK was the new tank back then and one of its highlights, I think it still has it at this moment, is its magical mitigation) and promised that they will make adjustments. Surely they did. Indomitability/Emergency Tactics was SE's answer to SCH missing an on-demand AoE healing other than Succor spamming.

And who would've forgotten the SMN that we have right now? It is not engaging and downright boring but still the job has undergone rework after rework, hopefully they do another. The changes might not be the right one but again, it is a progress.

Edit.. don't crucify me for saying this but I think in one of the interviews or whatever it is, the community has been allegedly labeled as "hard to please". I guess it shows, if accurate.

[Supersnow845]

I remember back during HW in one of their live letters. They acknowledged the overwhelmingly negative responses to PLD sucking so bad (blocks only affecting Physical damage when raid tiers are mostly magical because DRK was the new tank back then and one of its highlights, I think it still has it at this moment, is its magical mitigation) and promised that they will make adjustments. Surely they did. Indomitability/Emergency Tactics was SE's answer to SCH missing an on-demand AoE healing other than Succor spamming.

And who would've forgotten the SMN that we have right now? It is not engaging and downright boring but still the job has undergone rework after rework, hopefully they do another. The changes might not be the right one but again, it is a progress.

I mean I still don’t get why you think HW problems that were fixed 3 expansions ago have any relevance to the current talent or quality of the design team

PLD’s trajectory during EW has been well designed class that’s too weak->well designed class that’s still too weak but not as weak->diet GNB

If we are bringing up things they have “fixed” since HW we can also make an argument that just about every class has become better or worse in 10,000 different ways depending on the player

[rawker]

I mean I still don’t get why you think HW problems that were fixed 3 expansions ago have any relevance to the current talent or quality of the design team

I am merely making a reference to an instance where community feedback has pushed a change to a job that may even not be what they originally planned.

PLD’s trajectory during EW has been well designed class that’s too weak->well designed class that’s still too weak but not as weak->diet GNB

Weak in what area? DPS? Kindly elaborate.

If we are bringing up things they have “fixed” since HW we can also make an argument that just about every class has become better or worse in 10,000 different ways depending on the player

Partially correct. The main idea for everything I have said was them taking feedback from the community and attempts to implement it.

[Supersnow845]

I am merely making a reference to an instance where community feedback has pushed a change to a job that may even not be what they originally planned.



Weak in what area? DPS? Kindly elaborate.


Partially correct. The main idea for everything I have said was them taking feedback from the community and attempts to implement it.

They only corrected it due to “community feedback” because the job was quite literally unplayable without it, same as feedback corrections like energy drain in 5.0, lily’s in 6.0 and the like

Massive feedback requests on things that don’t actually break the function of classes never achieves anything, see recently the Kaiten debate which was universally panned by everyone or as an older example the lily system in stormblood which was so bad it’s why square now hides tooltips on skills till just before the patch drops, neither of those changes got fixed, lily’s took the entire expansion for them to be changed (entirely because even though they were trash they didn’t make WHM unplayable), and there is no evidence we will get Kaiten back

Square only makes sweeping changes to jobs responding to “community feedback” when said feedback is “without this the job is literally unplayable”

And yes I mean damage

[rawker]

And yes I mean damage

I am going to focus on this one. I am still in the middle of leveling my GNB so I need to know more of its intricacies and nuances but as far as my understanding, PLD's rotation does not involve a lot of double-weaving. The only time you do it is to fit all your oGCDs during Fight or Flight window, which even if you don't, it is more than enough GCDs to use them all.

GNBs, on the other hand, from what I have read is very busy. Also, between the 2, PLD, alongside WAR, is at the top in terms of self-sustenance. So in return, GNBs doing more DPS than a PLD is fair.