RP shout ads are obstructive to chat and gameplay

[Metalface_Villain]

Anyone under 18 should stay out.

say your kid is watching cartoons in the morning and suddenly they get an ad that warns it's 18 plus but then proceeds to advertise p-hub, would that be ok or should the tv station take measures for ads like that to not be there. imo that's pretty close to this, so saying just stay out or keep an eye on your kid 24/7 is a bit silly. people have had this same convo about gambling promotions on twitch and the normal take was that that wasn't ok. the only reason this is so debatable and controversial here in ff14 is because of the amount of perverts that we have. i had been playin wow for years, a game known for its bad community and its toxicity and i never encountered things like this, meanwhile one of my earliest experiences in ff14 was some dude and his catgirl trynna have sex with me xD

[Stormpeaks]

say your kid is watching cartoons in the morning and suddenly they get an ad that warns it's 18 plus but then proceeds to advertise p-hub, would that be ok or should the tv station take measures for ads like that to not be there. imo that's pretty close to this, so saying just stay out or keep an eye on your kid 24/7 is a bit silly. people have had this same convo about gambling promotions on twitch and the normal take was that that wasn't ok. the only reason this is so debatable and controversial here in ff14 is because of the amount of perverts that we have. i had been playin wow for years, a game known for its bad community and its toxicity and i never encountered things like this, meanwhile one of my earliest experiences in ff14 was some dude and his catgirl trynna have sex with me xD

I have played wow for 15+ years, there is ERP all over the place in there too, especially on moonguard goldshire and Argent dawn for EU, stop lying to yourself

[Metalface_Villain]

I have played wow for 15+ years, there is ERP all over the place in there too, especially on moonguard goldshire and Argent dawn for EU, stop lying to yourself

only place i know where there was erp in wow was on dedicated rp servers, in normal servers the worst i had seen is people spamming sit on others in goldshire xD

[Merrigan]

I have played wow for 15+ years, there is ERP all over the place in there too, especially on moonguard goldshire and Argent dawn for EU, stop lying to yourself

There are obviously some on WOW, but I find it less invasive overall? I must stress that this is my perception of the situation, and I obviously don't have any figures on the number of people who engage in this type of RP. Another thing that could potentially bother a bit more on FF is the "cute" side of the characters. I honestly find it hard to believe that Miqote, Lala and the rest look like adults. The Miqotes in particular remind me of 14-year-old girls. So inevitably, when you have characters like that getting involved in ERP, it adds a creepiness that WOW will never have.

That said, I'm still convinced of one thing: children are too often used as an excuse to make an environment more puritanical. In this case (ERP), I think the subject deserves to be discussed. But as it is part of a more general trend that has recently led to a series of outright censures in the artistic and literary spheres, all done with the proviso of protecting children, and at the risk of silencing voices that were tackling difficult but worthy subjects... Let's just say that the "children must be protected at all costs" argument is becoming highly unsympathetic. Not every environment can be child-friendly, that's just the way it is.

[strawberrycake]

There are obviously some on WOW, but I find it less invasive overall? I must stress that this is my perception of the situation, and I obviously don't have any figures on the number of people who engage in this type of RP. Another thing that could potentially bother a bit more on FF is the "cute" side of the characters. I honestly find it hard to believe that Miqote, Lala and the rest look like adults. The Miqotes in particular remind me of 14-year-old girls. So inevitably, when you have characters like that getting involved in ERP, it adds a creepiness that WOW will never have.

That said, I'm still convinced of one thing: children are too often used as an excuse to make an environment more puritanical. In this case (ERP), I think the subject deserves to be discussed. But as it is part of a more general trend that has recently led to a series of outright censures in the artistic and literary spheres, all done with the proviso of protecting children, and at the risk of silencing voices that were tackling difficult but worthy subjects... Let's just say that the "children must be protected at all costs" argument is becoming highly unsympathetic. Not every environment can be child-friendly, that's just the way it is.

While I can agree not every enviornment is meant for children and Adults need their own spaces to, what about the other cases, in this case with the Ops daughter do we say not everything needs to involve children?

I remember being a kid on an MMO, I've actually been approached sexually by a 30 yr old when i was 16, I didn;t do anything to gain such attention, I was just trying to do some weekly content before I joined a pug for reclears. I think theres a middle ground between protecting children and allowing adults to express themselves freely. Which is sually these things only being done in trusted groups, not just out in the open where other adults are even uncomfortable.

Like no ones saying you can't walk around butt naked, but why not do so in places where others including adults and children won't be bothered?

Like the reason I do not go to the Quick Sands when I visit friends on Balmung, is because of the literal nonesense that gets spewed in the shout chat there. or the creepy ass DMs I've recived. Now imagine the uninitiated. So while some people here are def being overly puritan in their zeal to get rid of ERP, I see it more so as the game has sadly attracted a lot of the fringe side of individuals and now children aren't safe period.

[Merrigan]

While I can agree not every enviornment is meant for children and Adults need their own spaces to, what about the other cases, in this case with the Ops daughter do we say not everything needs to involve children?

I remember being a kid on an MMO, I've actually been approached sexually by a 30 yr old when i was 16, I didn;t do anything to gain such attention, I was just trying to do some weekly content before I joined a pug for reclears. I think theres a middle ground between protecting children and allowing adults to express themselves freely. Which is sually these things only being done in trusted groups, not just out in the open where other adults are even uncomfortable. [...)

In the case of the OP's daughter, we're unfortunately in a grey area: that of the street and any other public space. In fact, in MMORPGs it's even blurrier, because most people don't notice your age. You're just one character among many, averaging between 15 and 30 years of age, with a majority of adults (it seems to me, given the age-related stats of MMORPG players). In this case, there's no magic solution. Either you stand behind your child and check everything that happens... or you accept that an incident (accident?) may occur. If I may make a suggestion, avoiding towns like Limsa may already be a good way forward.

You can reduce this type of behavior, but in general it can't happen with outright bans that never work. Which can't work for purely technical reasons either, because it's literally impossible to put in a moderator who would check the true age of each player (most minors lie), or ban any approach that's a little too direct from an ERP enthusiast. In FF's case, you'd have to do the following in order:

- Change the appearance of the characters. As I said above, I'm convinced that there's a link between the sexy miqote and the number of... strange ERPs to be found in the game.
- Reduce the possibilities for glamour, because clearly bikinis and the like greatly alter the openness at this level.
- Change the housing, because a system that allows massive meetings can only lead to this type of initiative.
- Potentially place a limit on IG communications systems.

And then, yes, maybe: you'll end up limiting this type of behavior because you're blocking all the possibilities that make this type of ERP attractive. You're making the soil infertile. The problem is that all these solutions block a lot of things for those who are adults, and I'm not talking about people who enjoy ERP, but those who keep the game alive in a more interesting way (drama clubs, for example).

[strawberrycake]

In the case of the OP's daughter, we're unfortunately in a grey area: that of the street and any other public space. In fact, in MMORPGs it's even blurrier, because most people don't notice your age. You're just one character among many, averaging between 15 and 30 years of age, with a majority of adults (it seems to me, given the age-related stats of MMORPG players). In this case, there's no magic solution. Either you stand behind your child and check everything that happens... or you accept that an incident (accident?) may occur. If I may make a suggestion, avoiding towns like Limsa may already be a good way forward.

You can reduce this type of behavior, but in general it can't happen with outright bans that never work. Which can't work for purely technical reasons either, because it's literally impossible to put in a moderator who would check the true age of each player (most minors lie), or ban any approach that's a little too direct from an ERP enthusiast. In FF's case, you'd have to do the following in order:

- Change the appearance of the characters. As I said above, I'm convinced that there's a link between the sexy miqote and the number of... strange ERPs to be found in the game.
- Reduce the possibilities for glamour, because clearly bikinis and the like greatly alter the openness at this level.
- Change the housing, because a system that allows massive meetings can only lead to this type of initiative.
- Potentially place a limit on IG communications systems.

And then, yes, maybe: you'll end up limiting this type of behavior because you're blocking all the possibilities that make this type of ERP attractive. You're making the soil infertile. The problem is that all these solutions block a lot of things for those who are adults, and I'm not talking about people who enjoy ERP, but those who keep the game alive in a more interesting way (drama clubs, for example).

It's sad that adults can't just behave in any enviornment other then IRL with the idea that the law is gonna come down on them hard for being weird around kids. Frankly XIV needs to be better about instilling that fear. Because all of that is literally NOT the point. THe point is that these adults are obviously being creepy, it's not the whole of people who like EPR, or sexual people, is that people aren't staying in the boundaries set.

So because these boundaries that were set aren't being respected, there needs to be some form of consequence.

[Merrigan]

It's sad that adults can't just behave in any enviornment other then IRL with the idea that the law is gonna come down on them hard for being weird around kids. [...]

Yes, but... Apart from lamenting the unfortunate fact that anonymity gives wings to a few unsavory individuals, it's hard to do anything here. I agree with you in principle, but I'm still waiting for ideas. Apart from what I said above, two other things bother me a little:

- Most people, I'm convinced, don't know that they're talking to children. There's a huge difference between someone who approaches you and proposes sexual activity on the assumption that you're 20+, and someone who approaches you because they know you're underage. I don't see any way of differentiating between the two, unless you completely ban this type of content as a prcaution....
- ... And this brings me to my second point: I'm not sure that a straight ban would be "better". As things stand, the ERP is visible. Which personally isn't too much to my taste, but so be it. Banning this type of activity won't make it disappear, it will just make ERP enthusiasts invisible. They'll move to secondary platforms, where FF moderation won't be able to do anything (discord), using FF as a transitional place to go and find the audience they're interested in. We're falling back on the good old debate between prohibition and legalization of prostitution (I'm going off-topic here to explain my point of view, I'm obviously not saying that child prostitution should be legalized. Clarification for those who are quick to caricature): legalization poses moral problems, but it does allow us to keep a framework, an overview of this type of activity. Complete prohibition, on the other hand, encourages excesses, because secrecy makes such excesses possible.

Take the example of the OP: his daughter came to see him about a term she didn't know the meaning of. This was undoubtedly embarrassing for both the child and the father, but the use of a clear term quickly put up barriers. Now, place this same young girl in an environment where the person offering her this type of activity forbids himself to use a certain term: the "recruiter" will use vague terms that won't necessarily cause alarm...... And and they could therefore attract her more easily to platforms where moderation is definitely more complex. And where excesses are potentially much more serious (photo exchanges and the like) than on FF.

That's why I doubt the effectiveness of the measures proposed by the OP, even beyond their feasibility. I hope I've made myself clear, and I'm sorry if the messages are a bit long.

As an aside, would it be possible to have a more civil discussion? I'm aiming particularly at the previous pages, where there are some pretty venomous exchanges on the subject. Of course, you're never safe from a troll on the forum, but if the OP is right, it's first and foremost a parent worried about his child. Which, it seems to me, is quite natural. As for the player who posted videos: it's true that, usually, this isn't spammed h24. But personally, I've been the "victim" of cascading offers at certain times of the day. So it depends a lot, both on the server and the timing, and it's true that if a kid is unlucky in this respect, it can become embarrassing.

[strawberrycake]

I have played wow for 15+ years, there is ERP all over the place in there too, especially on moonguard goldshire and Argent dawn for EU, stop lying to yourself

You mean the Dedicated RP servers made for Dedicated Rp where even the GMs make sure people are folowing the Rules of the Dedicated RP servers and are fairly hands on with how players interact in the, you know.....Dedicated RP server?

[TBerry]

say your kid is watching cartoons in the morning and suddenly they get an ad that warns it's 18 plus but then proceeds to advertise p-hub, would that be ok or should the tv station take measures for ads like that to not be there. imo that's pretty close to this, so saying just stay out or keep an eye on your kid 24/7 is a bit silly. people have had this same convo about gambling promotions on twitch and the normal take was that that wasn't ok. the only reason this is so debatable and controversial here in ff14 is because of the amount of perverts that we have. i had been playin wow for years, a game known for its bad community and its toxicity and i never encountered things like this, meanwhile one of my earliest experiences in ff14 was some dude and his catgirl trynna have sex with me xD

I'm fairly certain that would be against the law. Also I'm sure that these advertisements are required to mention it's 18+, and nothing explicit should be mentioned as that would be reportable behavior. Also 18+ can also mean other dark and adult themes, such as alcohol, drug use, swearing, shady/criminal acts, or even graphic descriction of violence. And everyone has the right to say no. Not complying is a surefire way to get a harassment report.
It is unfortunate that a minor was tried to get recruited, but there was no way for the player to know. The approach should have been different, and only once it was made sure the other player is 18 or over, should have been told what they would sign up for.
Though Wikipedia does not mention that courtesanship, at least in the traditional sense, would include ERP. And OP never told us what exactly the player wanted from her, I think.

[EDIT]
A I see, it's an eupenism for prostitute.