I'm bored when I heal because I need more complex DPS rotations

[Lyth]

I've seen that reference about job designers before, and it dates back to a Stormblood interview. The reason why I asked for a source is because I wanted to know what time period you were specifically referring to. I am genuinely interested in knowing how their job design process currently works, so if there's an up to date reference I would be definitely interested in seeing it. I tend to go to the source for most things, simply because I want to understand what's actually being said without alteration.

The SCH observation is a personal one that I've noticed from watching the game across multiple expansions. SE is extremely reluctant to do direct nerfs to jobs, sometimes at the cost of game balance. They would much sooner employ a system of 'upward balance' through job buffs alone, just to avoid the backlash. But the difficulty with this approach is that it leads to a gradual power creep that ends up being addressed inbetween expansions.

Job nerfs (stealth nerfs) typically happen during these transition periods when nobody has a sense of what any of the potencies and stat values mean. This is typically where they go after perennially powerful and dominant jobs. These jobs tend to stay in power perpetually because there's a strong and vocal backing from the fanbase, which in turn fuels their popularity.

The problem with this approach is that people catch on to the nerfs, and then start demanding buffs, until they're back in the position that they originally started off in. Over the course of each expansion cycle, you see this pattern repeat itself. WAR and SCH are two of the longest running targets of this.

This time, they opted for a slightly different strategy. They turned SCH into its own subrole, and created a new flavor, SGE. Now, you no longer have a unified fanbase demanding revisions. The same would be true if they introduced in a lifestealing Hammer tank as a counterpoint to WAR (and I would not be surprised if that is next in the cards for 8.x). In the long term, these sorts of approaches are good for the state of the game because they ensure comp diversity.

[IDontPetLalas]

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Job nerfs (stealth nerfs) typically happen during these transition periods when nobody has a sense of what any of the potencies and stat values mean. This is typically where they go after perennially powerful and dominant jobs. These jobs tend to stay in power perpetually because there's a strong and vocal backing from the fanbase, which in turn fuels their popularity.

The problem with this approach is that people catch on to the nerfs, and then start demanding buffs, until they're back in the position that they originally started off in. Over the course of each expansion cycle, you see this pattern repeat itself. WAR and SCH are two of the longest running targets of this.

This time, they opted for a slightly different strategy. They turned SCH into its own subrole, and created a new flavor, SGE. Now, you no longer have a unified fanbase demanding revisions. The same would be true if they introduced in a lifestealing Hammer tank as a counterpoint to WAR (and I would not be surprised if that is next in the cards for 8.x). In the long term, these sorts of approaches are good for the state of the game because they ensure comp diversity.

Thanks, and by the way Sebazy found exactly the thread I was thinking about - and clearly I have a faulty recall as it was more than 2 years ago!

I don't know. You're seeing SCH as the target of some nerfs and buffs, hello, former AST main here? Would like to discuss major job reworks here? Not to mention, your theory regarding some previously unified fanbase now being split is interesting, and that may be the case with some players, however I honestly don't see that as having a major impact, that "new flavour" SGE? It really isn't that new, in comparison to SCH, for many healers - nor, in comparison to any healer in many respects- for that matter. Nor do I follow your reasoning that there is now some healer 'comp diversity' that didn't exist before - it's like saying - did the pure/barrier healer split really make sense from a healer/encounter design? You'd probably get a fair number of arguments that would point to "no, not really".

[Sani2341]

They would much sooner employ a system of 'upward balance' through job buffs alone, just to avoid the backlash.

You and I must have exceedingly different definitions of 'job buffs'. Considering half the Healer changes going into shb could be summed Up as 'how dare you have Something worthwhile the other healers lack, let's take it away'

[Lyth]

...

Like I said, the transition between two expansions is where stealth nerfs generally happen. I can't think of too many examples where they openly reduced the potency of an action or remove an effect in the middle of an expansion (although I think most of the exceptions have been from this expansion). Even if a job has a significant dps advantage over all the others in its role category, they would much sooner buff every other job than reduce the dps numbers on that single job down to parity.

Keep an open mind and watch what happens during the transition period into Dawntrail. This is where they'll go after outstanding balance issues that they've wanted to address throughout Endwalker, but haven't dared to nerf publically.