Can we have an honest conversation about the Scions? Dawn Trail

[Jeeqbit]

In fact, the second half of the trailer is extremely boring and basic when you don't let hype dictate what you're observing. Once Picto gets revealed especially it feels like they literally ran out of ideas. It scares me tbh

The areas they have shown us (actual pictures, videos and footage of all the areas and its concept art) look like they have not ran out of ideas.

They just did not include all that in the trailer hardly. They deliberately made the trailer look like a holiday which is in complete contrast to all the dark, mountain, technological and desert areas we are getting.

[DPZ2]

This isn't even the only example. There are plenty of stories out there where the main character moves on from one group of companions to another.

True. And there are plenty of Japanese anime shows where the cast remained relatively stable for literally decades. Detective Conan, One Piece, and Naruto come immediately to mind. There were new people introduced constantly, but the core cast remained pretty much the same.

[Heroman3003]

This isn't even the only example. There are plenty of stories out there where the main character moves on from one group of companions to another.

Think you and a lot of the FFXIV playerbase needs to touch grass.

That would require having an actual main character. WoL does not have a real personality that would allow for that transition. In ff14 Alphinaud is closer to being well defined main character then WoL.

[TaleraRistain]

It's rather strange to me that people equate asking that the Scions take a backseat for a bit to attacking their close family and friends. From what we can see, only Krile and Thancred have any direct stake in Dawntrail, was it necessary to bring everyone else too? All the Scions being in Dawntrail is made even weirder by them stating after the "official disbanding" of the Scions of the Seventh Dawn that they should avoid all coming together for anything to keep up the pretense of the disbanding to the rest of the world, but suddenly it's fine for everyone to meet up and travel?

No one is asking for any of the Scions to die, just for some of them to take a backseat to make room for new characters, like how Y'shtola took a backseat for most of Stormblood.

Wait until 6.55 before assuming you know how everyone gets to the New World. They've told us so far only the twins are with us. Recent MSQ gave Krile a reason to be there. We don't know what brings everyone else along yet. Urianger did mention someone was looking for Archons so that could be a possible hook. Which means it could be less traveling together and everyone finding their way there through different means and realizing they've all been contacted for the same purpose. That would also strengthen the idea that the Scions are going to be divided.

[ReynTime]

Thankfully it looks like they might be testing waters with the idea of gradually phasing out older characters, if the promotional art of Dawntrail is any indication.

Not like any stable adult feels the need to be glued to the exact same group of colleagues everywhere they go.

That would require having an actual main character. WoL does not have a real personality that would allow for that transition. In ff14 Alphinaud is closer to being well defined main character then WoL.

This stopped being true since Shadowbringers and the ARR praetorium changes.

According to the forced reactions the writers impose on the player character the WoL:

-Tends to avoid drinking alcohol
-Gets emotional fairly easily
-Enjoys fame
-Is oblivious to stalking behavior
-Doesn't know much about politics
-Not particularly interested in any type of science except for very specific subjects they need to solve a minute mystery
-Enjoys the thrill of battle
-Forgives most bad guys they meet

The above are imposed and the player doesn't have any agency to change it except for headcanon that can't actually be applied to any quest or MSQ.

[Lyth]

It's possible that the Turali succession will not be resolved in the course of a single expansion. If there are rough plans through to 9.x, then the map itself provides a degree of insight into how this team 'split' might be structured.

[Jeeqbit]

It's possible that the Turali succession will not be resolved in the course of a single expansion. If there are rough plans through to 9.x, then the map itself provides a degree of insight into how this team 'split' might be structured.

I trust SE won't drag out a boring succession over more than one expansion. In fact, I doubt they will drag it out longer than the very start of the expansion. I think they are trying to mislead the majority of people (who will only see the trailer and nothing else) when the expansion has much more interesting stuff going on than that.

Remember the Stormblood trailer has us fight Lyse (which happens at level 69)?

Remember the Shadowbringers trailer had the Warrior of "Darkness" facing a boss from the first dungeon?

Remember the Endwalker trailer had the Warrior of Light facing a boss from a solo duty that happens at level 88?

What these have in common is they were all resolved within the expansion, so I think the fight in the new trailer will be resolved too.

What they all have in common as well is they weren't the last boss. In fact, they were all pretty minor fights that could have been excluded from the story. The last boss is usually hidden and only shown in the Launch Trailer (of MSQ game-rendered cutscenes) which typically contains some spoilers.

[Rithy255]

I like the scions personally, I hope to see them have many more character arcs while also introducing more characters slowly. I don't see any reason to phase them out completely, they're basically the main cast of XIV and I've enjoyed seeing how they have developed over the last 10+ years.

I think that's the thing, they haven't really been front and center for 10+ Years if you look back on the expansions, The only a consistent scion throughout the story is alphinaud and even then theirs been lots of time spent away from him.

ARR: Featured them somewhat, they certainly had some appearances, none of them really played a massive role (outside certain instances like post patch). But they were more side characters who would sometimes help.
HW: Yeah the only Important scion was alphinaud for the main story, banding the scions back together was a side story.
SB: Featured some scions, a lot of them didn't even play major roles, it focused a lot on new characters, some of which are fan favourites, the story again had them as more Side characters but some with major roles.
Shb: This was the first expansion to focus Heavily on growing the scions as people, you know what? it was good it worked, because we had development, a lot of them were in the story but were ones we didn't know a lot about, This allowed them to stay interesting & grow.
EW: This was the second expansion to focus on them, which again was fine, I think certain growth arcs were showing that it's hard to take them into directions that are Interesting, but it was decent, I think what's funny is one of the most liked areas didn't even have them, almost like we had room to learn about other interesting characters. I think we also knew that they were fine and have massive amounts of plot Armor

Do I think the Scions should be removed? No, they should play a smaller role then SHB/EW though, have some pop up and help, but focus on new cast, I think one of the Issues that newer expansions have is that they're afraid of showing us that characters are at risk, it feels like because the scions are the scions theirs no risk of losing them which is a issue in itself, HW had a lot of raw emotion to it because you knew that beloved characters weren't invincible, it was a great story, it's also fine for these characters to grow and there not to be anything to happen, but in reality the scions don't have much room to grow anymore, nor is there any semblance of risk epically after endwalker.

[Atelier-Bagur]

Urianger is literally not doing anything in the trailer. Don't get your hopes up.

In fact, the second half of the trailer is extremely boring and basic when you don't let hype dictate what you're observing. Once Picto gets revealed especially it feels like they literally ran out of ideas. It scares me tbh

Yeah lets just base off the entirety of DT's story on the pacing of a trailer.


What are you, 14?

[Jeeqbit]

the Issues that newer expansions have is that they're afraid of showing us that characters are at risk, it feels like because the scions are the scions theirs no risk of losing them which is a issue in itself, HW had a lot of raw emotion to it because you knew that beloved characters weren't invincible

While true, this fear of losing them was something we created in our minds because we didn't know the developers were protecting them this whole time. So we assumed the worst.

In reality, did we lose anyone that was added prior to an expansion? Let's review history.

• We lost lots of irrelevant, minor scions that were added in ARR, so that they could die in ARR.
• We lost Louisoix, added in 1.0 yes, but only really introduced to the majority of players in ARR so that he could die in ARR.
• We lost Moenbryda, added in 1.0 yes, but only really introduced to the majority of players in an ARR patch so that she could die shortly after.
• We lost Haurchefant, added shortly before Heavensward so that he could die in Heavensward.
• We lost Lady Iceheart, added shortly before Heavensward so that she could die in Heavensward.
• We lost Papalymo, perhaps the only one so far who genuinely survived multiple expansions prior to their death, but arguably they had been absent since ARR anyway and unlike the other Scions, SE couldn't find a way to make him unique from Urianger. They made Thancred unique by making him unable to use magic, they made Y'shtola unique by seeing aether instead of with her eyes, they made Lyse have this backstory that led into an expansion, they made Alisaie unique by making her an impulsive fighter that aspires to be a hero like you. But Papalymo was just another Urianger they couldn't salvage.
• We lost Minfilia, but it felt like we lost her once before back in ARR and she had been mostly absent since. So it was really just completing a death that sorta started in ARR. Despite being a 1.0 character, most people met her in 2.0 and then stopped seeing her after 2.0 beside the crystal cutscene.

So in hindsight, did we really lose anyone outside of the expansion they were create in/for? Not really, beside cutting ties with 1.0 characters they couldn't salvage.