Dawntrail Wishlist top 3 desired healer additions

[Renathras]

That's working out so well for AST right now (Granted it's also insufferable to play for extended periods but still).

Precisely. My point exactly.

Then I presume

No, you don't. And I'm tired of your backhanded condescension and won't be responding to it further. Good day, sir.

[ForsakenRoe]

No. That's the problem. Not unless we tune the numbers so that not using the extra buttons does the same damage, something that everyone would be adamantly against.

I literally did, though...? Way more closely than SE has ever bothered to, at least. With my proposed WHM, Banish is only 40p more than Glare. over a 10 min fight ignoring that button entirely causes a total of 1600p to be lost, which is less than 6 Glares. Or 75 seconds of Dia uptime (which, in a 10min fight, works out to be a DOT uptime of 87.5%). If 6 Glares is what makes or breaks the fight, you have much MUCH bigger issues than the healer. But it's not about the damage comparisons, is it? Because I've got week 1 savage logs where I cast over 30 healing GCDs for safety, and we still cleared with several seconds to spare. If the issue was really 'damage/the potential for suboptimal gameplay to cause issues for a party', you can take it up with SE for making the DOTs so strong compared to our filler. Or for piling everything into raidbuffs such that Crit Variance causes the issues it does. Or making the hard hits for jobs be such massive potency numbers, leading to even bigger damage swings between CDH and regular noncrit hits.

Pressing Glare instead of Banish would cost only 40p, on the GCD that would cause you to lose a Banish from the fight timeline. That's once per 15s. Averaged out across 6 GCDs, the loss per GCD for not using this new skill is a mere 6.6 potency. For comparison, Dia's ticks are 65p per 3 seconds. A missed positional on any melee but DRG/SAM is 60p. SAM's are 50p, DRG's are 40p, with two back to back. An autoattack is 75p. Using Banish at the right time would effectively be a 'healer positional', except it doesn't require positioning. And delaying it for an upcoming movement section costs you only 7p per GCD, but gains you the damage of a GCD in the movement section you would not have had before, thereby increasing your damage contribution, not decreasing it. I don't know how much maths you need to be given before you realize how absolutely ridiculous the hill you're dying on is.

Heck, if you want I could go and buff Glare/reduce Banish/Dia's damage, such that they're all completely equal damage. Doesn't matter which you press, just press any of em, in any order. But there will still be ways for people to do more damage than others in my design because of the self-refunding heal skill. Putting the refund of Quake/Tornado/Flood into raidbuffs means dealing more damage than someone who does not, and we can't have that can we?

The 'no u' didn't escape my notice either, very masterful debate tactic right there

"Oh, you like WHM but you don't like a damage rotation but you still want to perform optimally and that's what you enjoy? Yeah, you don't get to enjoy that anymore. Because I say so."

Damn, guess if we look at your previous performance on the verboten site we'll see you have 100's across the board, since you are so insistent on performing optimally? Oh right, people don't perform optimally. We're not robots, we make mistakes, or choose incorrectly at times in the heat of the moment. That's part of the game. I'm garbage by my own admission. I think I play at a blue level. But I get purples often, because we're at the point where the only bloody metrics are 'did you keep your DOT up' and 'did you press Glare'. Even Misery-in-buffs doesn't matter, because the extra damage doing that gives, is given to the buffer, not the WHM.

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

Once again, the same energy:

:kekw:

Don't worry, you have me for that. I don't feel bad about it. Because I feel like at this point I've seen every single angle on the Sylphie attack vector. I'm beyond over it and uninterested in a "good faith discussion" about it. Because there really isn't common ground. You see, every discussion in this vein starts seemingly neutral. I want X, they want Y, there's a vague attempt to describe a world where X and Y have their time in the sun. But push them on it even a little bit and they start stamping their feet and revealing what they actually want: not X. They don't want Y. They want -not X-. Suggest a skill ceiling and the wailing and gnashing of teeth begins.

These people don't want low skill floors. They want nonexistent skill ceilings. They don't want accessible content, not really. What they want is healing to be an easy path to free stuff. Paying attention to your job's resources is bad. Even the existence of a suboptimal-but-still-present GlareMedica2 rotation that could satisfy the zero interactivity isn't enough. They want the lazy no-thought gameplay to be the optimal gameplay. They don't want to climb the mountain before them. They want to bulldoze it down, walk into the rubble, and declare they're at the peak now. They want an easy job that they can be told they're masters of by dint of unlocking the job stone.

Prod literally any Sylphie who claims they sympathize with the desire for more complex gameplay and that's the tantrum you're going to get. Every single time.

'Tis no wonder it's impossible to see a common ground. Why do people even bother? lol

[ForsakenRoe]

The post that keeps on giving, absolutely timeless

[Connor]

So uhhh….where is this massive group of ‘Sylphies’ who want all healers to be pure healing, no dps, no support, no nothing but just heals. And they want it to be the easiest job in the whole game so they can just beat Ultimate with no effort. They sure as hell aren’t on the forums outside of some blatant trolls. Not seeing any in this thread. I can’t think of any time I’ve ever seen someone legitimately ask for no dps spells whatsoever, no support spells, no utility, just heals heals heals.


…where are they? Who asked for that? One individual is not a large group.

Can we stop blaming things on this invisible illuminati-style unseen group, and start blaming the ones who actually made these decisions….. the devs . Full assault!

[Supersnow845]

So uhhh….where is this massive group of ‘Sylphies’ who want all healers to be pure healing, no dps, no support, no nothing but just heals. And they want it to be the easiest job in the whole game so they can just beat Ultimate with no effort. They sure as hell aren’t on the forums outside of some blatant trolls. Not seeing any in this thread. I can’t think of any time I’ve ever seen someone legitimately ask for no dps spells whatsoever, no support spells, no utility, just heals heals heals.


…where are they? Who asked for that? One individual is not a large group.

Can we stop blaming things on this invisible illuminati-style unseen group, and start blaming the ones who actually made these decisions….. the devs . Full assault!

Spend more than one roulette not playing a healer and you’ll find them

[Aravell]

Can we stop blaming things on this invisible illuminati-style unseen group, and start blaming the ones who actually made these decisions….. the devs . Full assault!

To be fair to everyone, some people need to also stop blaming this weird shadow group of people who want every healer to have BLM style rotations. Then we can all talk like rational adults.

[Connor]

Spend more than one roulette not playing a healer and you’ll find them

Maybe it’s a DC thing, but literally everytime I play a dps I’ve had a healer that dps’s. I genuinely cannot remember the last time I went into content and the healer made no effort to dps. I’ve seen plenty of poor healing skills, Medica II at full HP, over reliance on GCD heals, not enough oGCD, etc. I’ve seen people Glare infrequently and not do 100% uptime on their DoT, but then I wouldn’t say that’s a Sylphie. Isn’t the whole argument the so-called ‘dps crowd’ makes that Sylphies can just not hit their dps spells and nobody will care? I’d say even a token effort to dps means they’re actively trying not to be a completely dead weight.

But I’ve still not seen a healer flat out refuse to deal damage when the entire party is above 80% HP. As an aside, I’ve also never seen a pure Ice Mage. I’ve seen some very unfortunate Black Mages who’ve completely misunderstood the point of Transpose, using Fire I over IV, etc. but I’ve still not met a Black Mage who exclusively uses Blizzard spells.

I mean I do player healers most of the time so maybe that’s getting in the way, but from my experience playing as a dps (even when I was a Bard main) it’s been extremely rare to practically non-existent for healers to do literal 0 damage.

To be fair to everyone, some people need to also stop blaming this weird shadow group of people who want every healer to have BLM style rotations. Then we can all talk like rational adults.

I agree with this too. It’s less commonly referred to but there is also the idea of a ‘reverse Sylphie’ who wants solely death and destruction on all healers and they should never have to heal again. To which we can ask the question…where are these people lol? I don’t think I can see them

[BRVV]

No, you don't. And I'm tired of your backhanded condescension and won't be responding to it further. Good day, sir.

Don't assume their intentions. It's literally what you called me out for

My post was "Condolences, I agree with what you said, and I'm sorry you were hurt."

No it was not. You should look up what quoting means.

This was your post:

My condolences. It's not you, that's just how people tend to respond to things here.

Feel free to post what you think any time. For what it's worth, I agree with you. I propose something I call "The 4 Healers Model" all the time to address just this thing, as well as overall changes to encounters and diversifying the healer Jobs' kits more to give people more options and ensure people have more that they can feel they can engage with well.

But there is a lot of "Not taking yes for an answer" going on these days. I'm sorry you had to be on the receiving end of it, though.

First sentence is your condolences. With just 2 words. It's followed by a backhanded insult and the next paragraph is an ad for the 4 healer (TM) and the last paragraph is backhanded insults again.

Well, it proves what I always say: All it takes to get likes here is to lie about and caricature anything I say, and the more absurd and ridiculous it is, the more likes it will get. I should try it sometime.

Sorry for reading your posts and using logic to understand your opinion. Do you want to be ignored by all? You can just not post.

"Oh, you like WHM but you don't like a damage rotation but you still want to perform optimally and that's what you enjoy? Yeah, you don't get to enjoy that anymore. Because I say so."

They never said that. Please show me where they said exactly that.

I'm so tired of you being everywhere and being toxic with every post.

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

So uhhh….where is this massive group of ‘Sylphies’ who want all healers to be pure healing, no dps, no support, no nothing but just heals. And they want it to be the easiest job in the whole game so they can just beat Ultimate with no effort. They sure as hell aren’t on the forums outside of some blatant trolls. Not seeing any in this thread. I can’t think of any time I’ve ever seen someone legitimately ask for no dps spells whatsoever, no support spells, no utility, just heals heals heals.


…where are they? Who asked for that? One individual is not a large group.

Can we stop blaming things on this invisible illuminati-style unseen group, and start blaming the ones who actually made these decisions….. the devs . Full assault!

I can't speak for other but myself: when I say "Sylphie" or use a quote from another's post, I'm typically referring to the group that refuses to learn for better despite circumstances. "Only want to heal" is only one from many facets of a "Sylphie mindset". Notice how I specifically bold that part in Semi's old quote? Yes, those are the ones.