The new 24 man alliance raids are a disappointment (mechanic wise)

[Arkdra]

Aglaia was fine. I experienced wipes to every boss in Orbonne in the first few weeks. People wiped in ST all the time. Usually for dumb reasons, but the most common legit raid killer was fucking up curtain call. But back when you had to do the mechanics, people clowned the orbs on Scylla in a way that caused a wipe more than once. I once had a Xande wipe happen because all 3 gravity nerds stacked, that was hilarious. Had a few wipes caused by people not standing in the piss circles on Xande. Even had a glasya wipe one time because i think all of the healers stood in freeze zones and then nobody got them out.

Nier raids? Saw wipes on every boss in the first few weeks. Shout outs in particular to line stack friendly fire on the 2nd boss of bunker.

[AmiableApkallu]

It's too visually busy and, especially the last fight, there's too much going on all at once.

My two cents: Visually, the fight itself is fine. The problem is 4, 8, or 24 characters' worth of blinding attacks and spells, which is less about the encounters and more about every job having flashy visuals.

[Raven2014]

My two cents: Visually, the fight itself is fine. The problem is 4, 8, or 24 characters' worth of blinding attacks and spells, which is less about the encounters and more about every job having flashy visuals.

Which is why there is an option to turn off visual effect from other players.

[Nestama]

Aglaia was fine. I experienced wipes to every boss in Orbonne in the first few weeks. People wiped in ST all the time. Usually for dumb reasons, but the most common legit raid killer was fucking up curtain call. But back when you had to do the mechanics, people clowned the orbs on Scylla in a way that caused a wipe more than once. I once had a Xande wipe happen because all 3 gravity nerds stacked, that was hilarious. Had a few wipes caused by people not standing in the piss circles on Xande. Even had a glasya wipe one time because i think all of the healers stood in freeze zones and then nobody got them out.

Nier raids? Saw wipes on every boss in the first few weeks. Shout outs in particular to line stack friendly fire on the 2nd boss of bunker.

You know, its been a hot minute but yeah I think I have seen a few wipes in ST back in the day. That said, that raid was extremely disappointing compared to Labyrinth of the Ancients. It felt more like a glorified dungeon, whereas LotA felt more raid-like (more "split into threes" or something).

[Post]

Because that's not the default, I wouldn't expect most players to recognize if that's an issue they're having and adjusting for it.

Instead, we generate ad hype by adding flashy moves with shallow uses to load up our job actions trailer every few years and then have to make gigantic red spinny tank buster spirals complete with 5 second cast bars that we have to retroactively add to the second boss of the Stone Vigil so new players will learn that subtlety in support of the story or setting is not something high on their priorities, Puddingway!

What was I saying? Oh yeah, Expedient is probably the most effectual support tool in EW and it was mocked in the trailers because it wasn't a bunch of flashy bullshit.

This might not be much of a problem, but I don't doubt the visuals arms race has impacted the battle design and is partially how we ended up here.

[remiff]

More than that, they even reused mechanics from the very same tier for the final boss, things you saw 20 minutes ago.
I was legit expecting the "13th" to have a Venat like encounter but not even. There wasn't even a 2nd phase.

The final boss visual was also disappointing, it really feels like the chara designer went "random bullshit, go!".
It feels like my old Bionicle on which I fused every Bionicles I owned.

I get in some cases such as TG Cid and Ultima, the first is way cooler, but Ultima has nothing to be ashamed of.
This final boss literally has the charisma of a recycling bin.

It was even worse than that, it was completely lazy.

They reused the 3D skeleton from the 12th floor of Eden and exactly the same battle design, meaning recycling spells from previous bosses.

Ultima the Great Seraph did the same thing, but it was only Part 1, and the boss had truly unique mechanics,
here, we're encountering more and more recycled bosses with no flavor.

It was a total letdown, they could have done better, but they really seem to be running out of ideas.

Mechanically speaking, it was highly disappointing in every sense of the term,
the game is stagnating.

[Thurmnmurmn]

snip

Man you're still going at it eh. Are you this defensive on people saying it's too easy because you feel it's an attack on your skills?

The fact you say a wipe means it's savage difficulty is quite telling.

[Rokke]

The issue with these fights is that the bosses are for the most part
castbar attack
long pause
castbar attack
long pause
and then they die right as we finally reach overlapping or quick successions of mechanics, which makes the raid feel like a string of tutorials with no payoff. I hope for the next xpac they shorten the "instructional" part of the fight. The mechanics themselves are ok they're just way too spaced out.

[ZephyrMenodora]

My two cents: Visually, the fight itself is fine. The problem is 4, 8, or 24 characters' worth of blinding attacks and spells, which is less about the encounters and more about every job having flashy visuals.

Unfortunately my first time going had 7 Summoners -.- So much clutter on the battlefield with that many. Actually added to the difficulty.

[ChrysOCE]

Would be curious what the general ilvl is, for people doing this. I was in 640 WHM gear and yea, 3 vuln stacks and could still brush off another attack. To my mind, 2 vuln stacks on healer and you should not be surviving the next hit. If the reward gear is 650, the raid should be designed around this. Challenging (but not impossible and wipe after wipe after wipe) but, as you clear each week and get your gear up, it becomes easier (without it turning into Endsinger, pre-fix).

It also feels like more than just gear though. It's feels like the fights just aren't tuned to general level 90 kit. We have SO many abilities now, for both Healer and Tank. They can throw things out faster but they don't. WHM - oGCD heals, regen, medica II, plenary indulgence, liturgy of the bell, aquaveil, two charges of divine benison, temperance, aslyum. Almost like... there's no point in a tank buster, cause that will never bust a tank anymore.