I'm bored when I heal because I need more complex DPS rotations

[IDontPetLalas]

Exactly where did I say they couldn't have more? Point it out for me, please. My point is only that AST never had many damage buttons, not that they can never have any more. I personally wouldn't mind if we returned wholesale to SB AST where they had most of their engagement come from the card system, I'd wager most AST mains from back then wouldn't mind the 2 DoTs and 1 filler either.

Honestly, for how much you guys jump on Ren for drawing his own conclusions and putting words in your mouths, you're also doing the same thing to me right now.

"I doubt many would complain about having only 1 DoT and 1 nuke" My response was a direct reaction to this as was Ask. No one is "putting words in your mouth" , you may want to go back and read your post as this came directly from you.

[Aravell]

"I doubt many would complain about having only 1 DoT and 1 nuke" My response was a direct reaction to this as was Ask. No one is "putting words in your mouth" , you may want to go back and read your post as this came directly from you.

And which part of that statement shows that I said they can't have any more damage actions? Please tell me how many hoops you had to jump through to get to the conclusion that I'm pushing for you and everyone else to accept the 1 DoT 1 nuke gameplay. You are attributing hidden reasonings and meanings to my words when I have already made clear, twice, exactly what I'm saying. That is the very definition of putting words in my mouth.

Let me reiterate for you, very clearly, what I'm saying, again. Because you clearly aren't reading what I'm saying. AST did not have a multitude of damage actions back in SB, many AST mains just want the old card system back, I doubt many would mind having only 1 DoT and 1 nuke if they get full engagement from the card system and surrounding systems again. Note that I said many, not most, not all, many. Read this time, thank you.

[ForsakenRoe]

Idk it just seems like every healer thread invariable devolves into a mud slinging contest. ‘You’re a SYLPHIE who HATES DPS and doesn’t do [insert specific high-level content]’, ‘You’re a GREEN DPS who wants nothing more than to stomp new healers into bloody pulps and make their lives hell’. And I’ll be the first to admit I’m guilty of it too. There’s too much scapegoating (‘strawmanning’? To use everyone’s favourite forum buzzword lol).
Sylphies are not ruining the game by wanting to heal more. Green dps are not ruining the game by wanting to dps more.

Addendum: there should be a rule against posting this much at one time. GM’s have mercy on me lol I didn’t realise how bad it was until the damage was already done lol

There is a balance to be struck, I think, and I do agree, having more healing required would feel more thematic to the role. But we've been given so many 'more healing' solutions (without enough of the 'problem' to require so many solutions) that the balance is already pre-skewed, and the 'more damage buttons' suggestion could be seen as trying to rebalance things, not shift it all the way to the opposite side. If we look at SB, once they had gotten rid of the clunky stuff like old Cleric Stance, we had some damage buttons, some healing buttons. We didn't have an obscene flood of different OGCDs to use. If we go back to HW, we had even less OGCD healing. AST, IIRC, had literally zero AOE OGCD healing options. It's not just a case of 'healing requirements haven't really increased', but also 'healing capability of players has absolutely skyrocketed over time'. I'd like to think that the 'ideal solution' would be like, more damage buttons, more healing required, but having the two halves of the kit (damage and healing) fit together more smoothly than what we have now. Lilies are a good example of what I'd like things to be like, you have to heal at some point, then later on you cash in a big refund of all the damage you lost in a satisfying blast that hits for like 80k. So I think like, why not the opposite, where you dealing damage gives you access to a big heal tool, and then that big heal also has a way to make itself damage neutral, so you flow between damage/healing/damage etc more seamlessly than the sudden 'handbrake applied' feeling of dropping everything to hardcast a Medica 2.

Also, you can put text in the tags [H*B] and [/H*B] (without the *s) and it'll make a 'click to show' box like if you want to hide a spoiler or whatever

like this

you can nest them inside one another too!

And do you want to know the kicker? If it was released again as a new fight now, it still wouldn’t be enough to keep us healing the whole time.

I do wonder how much of that fact is down to how many extra healing tools we have in the kit now. Like, Heartless took some Cure3 pumping to get through, but with Lilybell we could place and instantly detonate that for 1000p which is like, half the healthbar. Pneuma's 900 with Zoe. Those two alone would solve like 90% of the check and they're both zero damage lost. Heck, Plenary > Rapture's 600, even the fact that the lily system was dog doo bad back then is a factor compared to the kit we know now

[Connor]

snip

Thanks lol, I’ve tried to clean up the post a little (at least as much as I can on mobile lol).

I do get what you mean; we have so many ultra powered healing abilities that there’s really no where to go other than down the ‘offensive / non-healing’ route. Not only that, but readjusting things so we did have to use all those healing abilities would be just as difficult / impossible due to all the rebalancing and adjustments that were needed, the pressure it’d put on new healer, etc.

I think you’re right as well about having damage feed into healing and vice-versa. I think it’d be better for both sides of the argument if we didn’t have this clear divide between ‘attack’ and ‘healing’ toolkits. If they both interacted and synergised in interesting ways it’d go far in making both healing and attacking more enjoyable, or at least I think it would lol. Especially for jobs like White Mage and Sage who already (well, in theory lol) have interaction between damage and healing. I also like the idea of healing being able to indirectly affect dps like the PvP version of Adloquium (damage buff). It gives ways for healers to still utilise their healing toolkits but in ways that can affect overall party dps, so there’s always the feeling of positive contribution. Plus it would make it easier to avoid running into an ‘energy drain’ situation where you have to choose between healing or damage, which I’m not a fan of personally - because, why not both lol