What's the point with that quite lackluster story in Endwalker?

[Heroman3003]

Oh... a, "The Sundering was right." bloke. Yeah, you're the one who's here in bad faith, pal.

Nice 'anyone who disagrees with me is a troll' here. This is why I don't take this thread seriously.

[MikkoAkure]

Killing a main character just to show that what's going on in the plot is dangerous is never a good idea, that's what red shirts are typically for. You typically only kill major NPCs when it is going to have an impact on the surviving characters and contribute to their character growth. It needs to feel earned. It should also pass down part of the investment into the character into a different form, whether that's a hardened goal that lasts longer than 1 arc or a big change in a surviving character that lasts the rest of the life of the series.

Otherwise your story just comes off as needlessly dark and edgy and some people will lose interest.


Serenity is a good example where the main cast all survive the original show Firefly, and then by the end of the sequel movie a couple get killed off to show that things are dangerous and it turned off a lot of fans and that show didn't even last a full season. But I'd go and say that most media, even long-running ones, keep their main characters intact the whole time. People get attached to characters the longer they're around and killing them off after over a decade for no good reason doesn't make sense.

It's different for one-off single-player games or short shows, but you don't really see long-running ones do that and they often have fake deaths or revivals just like FFXIV does. Stargate was around for just as long as FFXIV and had quite a few secondary characters die and the main cast had "deaths" and revivals, ascensions and descensions, etc. and ended the series witth the original main cast intact and no one batted an eye. Star Trek famously killed off Spock only to bring him back in the next movie and from my little passing knowledge of Star Trek, they all keep the same cast for years upon years with no major deaths despite being in danger the whole time.


That's not to say there haven't been moments where main characters could or even should have died and had an actual impact. Yotsuyu, Gosetsu, and Zenos most certainly should have died and the story would've been better for it. Thancred could've been killed off in ShB against Ran'jit and that would've had a greater impact on Ryne, especially if she managed to cross worlds with the rest of the cast to become a main character in his stead. G'raha could've died on the tower and the scene was a little awkwardly drawn out and dramatic considering that at the time it felt obvious that he was going to come back.

For Endwalker, the main character death we're meant to care about (for better or worse) is Hydaelyn/Venat and I can't really think of where another would've really fit in there and had an actual lingering effect on the rest of the characters.

[Oizen]

Thats fine if they don't want to kill off characters, but god damn am I tired of flashing back to the characters they were willing to kill nearly 10 years ago as if they're still the stakes for whats going on.

A lot of the Endwalker deaths are very much have your cake and eat it too, we were given a magic rock that can revive dead people and revived Emet Selch who died last expansion,and he in turn revived everyone who """""died"""" at the end of endwalker.

Death has no meaning now. The characters are too marketable to kill, but they want that cheap drama from theatening it anyway.

[AwesomeJr44]

A lot of the Endwalker deaths are very much have your cake and eat it too, we were given a magic rock that can revive dead people and revived Emet Selch who died last expansion,and he in turn revived everyone who """""died"""" at the end of endwalker.

Yep. Also, all of the characters that do die are characters that were introduced this expansion. Makes it pretty clear that they're not willing to kill off any of the older characters and so they introduce new ones to take the fall for them.

[Kozh]

For Endwalker, the main character death we're meant to care about (for better or worse) is Hydaelyn/Venat and I can't really think of where another would've really fit in there and had an actual lingering effect on the rest of the characters.

Literally any of the scions would fit this. Want to see affects? Have one of the Twins die. Have either thancred/ysthola/urianger died. Heck, even kill one of the Twin's parent to really drive EW message/theme.


When was the last time a core member of scion died? In HW (papalymo) {Technically minfilia died in ShB, but everyone hates her, so she doesn't count imo}
So like, even by your standard, it has been a long time.

And frankly, even the NPC who died in EW are not close to the main characters. They're literal random nobodies. With the red shirt, at the very least they're part of our crew who has been working under us for quite some time.

[Kozh]

As I have said it before, if ffxiv could write realistic and impactful consequences to main character's action other than killing the characters themselves, I won't have problem. Truth be told, I'm not even the type of person who likes character's death as catalyst for other character's development. Often times, it's lazy, and yes, edgy.

But the problem here is that ffxiv can't even do that. Just look at y'sthola (and to an extent, thancred). Her missing vision doesn't affect her in any way. At the very least, Thancred has to change jobs and risk his life when fighting formidable enemy because of it. Y'sthola? Lol. Even her supposed "burn through her life force to see with aether" is not a thing in JP iirc.

Arenvald is the only one that's a good example of this consequences thing, which also effect Alphinaud, but that's just one example.


So I don't really blame people for wanting main NPC to die for consequences and stakes, because that's the level ffxiv is capable of (and willing to).

[Cach]

Also just dropping this here, the product of a joint project of some of those of us critical of the story (or to some, 'Zodiark trancers'):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c98qO-wW30A

The remaining parts will be released gradually over the coming couple of weeks, so I'd recommend subscribing to the channel if these catch your fancy.

As ever, a link to the discord for those who'd like to catch up outside the thread remains active here.

I got this organically recommended to me by the youtube algorithm, didn't know it was originated here!
thumbed up, subbed and recommended to friends.

[Theodric]

It's hilarious to me that the jokes about watching the Scions eat tacos next ended up ringing true.

[ReynTime]

I'm glad it's CENTRAL america, which makes for a more interesting inspiration than either south or north. But seeing all the scions there again makes me lose interest.

[MikkoAkure]

I'm glad it's CENTRAL america, which makes for a more interesting inspiration than either south or north. But seeing all the scions there again makes me lose interest.

The Pelupelu feel very South America inspired. As is the name of their region "Urqopacha" which sounds Incan. They also ride alpacas, also from South America, and the part of the New World map shown so far is the southern half. The building in the mountainous region also look like they could be inspired from the Andes.

I wouldn't rule out the northern half of the cloud cover disappearing either. Perhaps even Meracydia, but I would prefer a centrally located expansion.