Please make Criterion reward gear.

[Pickledpinkpeppers]

No, Savage level content should reward Savage gear. But Criterion normal should remove the 1 rezz per boss bs already and keep that in the actual savage version of it. And reward the coins after every boss kill, not at the end. Imagine wanting to do this 25 times to get your mount, your orchestrion and your frame kit in PF. Clearing it once by the grace of the Gods is already a feat.

[Reinhardt_Azureheim]

No, Savage level content should reward Savage gear. But Criterion normal should remove the 1 rezz per boss bs already and keep that in the actual savage version of it. And reward the coins after every boss kill, not at the end. Imagine wanting to do this 25 times to get your mount, your orchestrion and your frame kit in PF. Clearing it once by the grace of the Gods is already a feat.

The only reason we claim that only Savage should reward Savage level gear outside of welfare patch x.1/x.3/x.5 is because we never had a precedent of decently difficult content not rewarding anything viable and therefore never questioned it.

Yes Criterion Normal should not grant the same iLv as Savage or Tome Augmented, but an Augmentation via Criterion Savage or other ways could justify this.

The 1-rez-cast per player is a healthy feature for criterion normal. It doesn't give complete freedom, but it gives options by not having to bring or depend on SMN RDM. I don't think it has a place in Criterion Savage, nor would it benefit - the timer starts with the first aggroed mob so a dead player will cost you a ton of time so you might as well restart.

And no, it should absolutely not give coins after each boss kill. That will only lead to situations where farming it will result in only killing the first and maybe 2nd boss.

Our community's general ability to be a liability and disrespecting each other's time in Party Finder is not a reason to dumb things down to the lowest common denominator.

[dspguy]

Depending on the difficulty of criterion(savage) - make it drop i655 (no weapons) and limit drops to one per week. They can be lazy and take another piece of gear's model and just add +1 to change the stats.

[Karshan]

I have only done the very basic one of each, not the criterion so my point might not be relevant.
But I do Savage Raids.

Given they come out two months later, I'd be entirely ok for the normal version to drop 650 stuff and savage version to drop 660. People who are doing criterion savage are either :
- 8man raiders, that can then stuff multiple jobs with more ease to go in 8 man in another job to have fun (without griefing by being minimum ilvl)
- People who don't like / can't join statics / are fed up with PF or just don't raid 8 man, who would gear in 660 in october anyway thanks to raid 24.

So as long as the criterion is not released at the same time as a savage, I'd be entirely for the introduction of max ilvl gear. The only limit is the creativity of the devs who would have to design 3 sets per tier and not 2.

"meeu only people doing savage should have access to 660 gear, where is the merit" well we're 2 months in, you should already be 659 /660 if you raid while Criterion guys would only be STARTING to gear up. And again, the guys catching up are either :
- doing 8man savage already, and only stuffing a sub job so they know the fights and won't ruin your PF
- not doing 8man savage, so you won't see them in your PF anyway
so where would be the harm ? It's not criterion's fault some people lack validation in their lives so much they are counting on gear pieces to bring it to them, somehow ? I think Criterion Savage should have some reward to it as well.

[Nicola_Kunu]

I really like the idea of Criterion rewarding 650 gear as an alternative route to gear secondary classes.

All of my current gear this savage tier has been funnelled to my main class and my secondary classes are still lacking behind and still have mostly 640 gear (especially considering the dearth of Shines/Twines and how many are needed...)
The only other place to get 650 gear right now is Tomes which has a weekly cap anyway.

It already fits a sweet spot as an Extreme/Savage level dungeon, but I have no desire to run it after clearing it for the first time. If it dropped 1 or 2 pieces of 650 gear a week, I would have a weekly incentive to clear it whilst working towards the longer-term rewards the dungeon offers. I don't have any desire to run it 25 times for the mount for example if that's the only light at the end of the tunnel.

It does fill the same niche as 650 Alliance Raid Gear (which will come in a couple patches) but clearing the Alliance Raid isn't "difficult" per se, so being able to get 650 gear earlier for harder content would still be a nice reward.

As for the production/development side of actually creating gearsets for the alternative 650 gear, the quick and dirty option would be a coffer that rewards Tomestone gear for the class that opens it. I can understand the lack of desire to create a whole set of new gearsets for every class + race for each Criterion Dungeon.

[Hysteria-XS]

If only to get people to stop complaining about "dead on arrival" content I'd love for some of these ideas to be implemented.

[Aniya_Estlihn]

No. Savage should still reward better gear because it is more difficult and time consuming activity . Spoon feeding is not the answer

Counter point: its all replaceable drivel that'll be made obsolete 4-6mo down the line or be reduced to leveling gear for the upcoming expansion so it quite literally does not matter.

I think the biggest issue with gearing is players who think gear has any tangible value or prestige to it when ultimately, it's just stat sticks that are meant to be tossed aside in less than a year. They don't want to upset the deluded players who think that gear actually means something and so we'll likely never see meaningful change because of opinions like your own, as they're too afraid to add more sources for fear of stepping on the toes of raiders who think their gear is some sort of badge of honor.

And yes, I have raided in the past. Gear was never the draw for me or most of those whom I ran with, it was experiencing the fights and the social aspect that kept us all going. Gearing just felt like a necessity, one that no one really necessarily enjoyed, for that matter.

[kidknee]

Gear is useless after next .2 patches we get next crafted gear anyways.
Gear might increase content engagement and it will be easy for others to find party for criterion.
Right now no groups in pf for that content.
Even if somebody has a slight spark of wanting to do the content .... No pf groups and lack of gear rewards would tilt people in the direction of not doing he content.