Zepla about FFXIV Relic and Square Enix not taking any Risks

[Shurrikhan]

XIV was never HIM, WoW was though.....& if you are associated with HIM, you are cool by default.

I'm very confused. Is "HIM" here supposed to be an acronym? I was even on the lookout for references to "the guy", "the man", "the big bad", etc., etc.... but there was nothing.

Best guess so far:
This guy... but as a metaphor?

[Elkanah]

I have my own opinions for Endwalker. It turned out to be my favorite for its message (for just the main story end arc). My Dad passed away a few weeks before it released on early access, so I was going through a rather rough time leading up to it. And it helped me through moreso because my WOL is essentially a reflection of my own person irl. So it did hit me the hardest after the ending. Everything that came after 6.0 (6.1 and so on) bored the crap out of me lmao. I'm glad I finished XVI and Diablo IV this year-- but I went back to XI after. There's not much for me to do till savage next release in 7.0 honestly (had some really bumpy runs with a lot of prog groups and gave up because I was tired of bad party finders and groups who cannot communicate well across all the DCs in NA). My attachment to the game has gone stale though with all the content we've received thus far since the start of the expansion. I'm hoping 7.0 has something better in store. :/

[LilimoLimomo]

Okay. Let's put it this way:

She's a content creator who's established herself around FFXIV. To make money, she will primarily be playing XIV (or reacting to other content creators' [reacting to other content creators' [etc.] XIV-related, -comparative, or -adjacent content), and her doing so has to be at least decently entertaining to her viewers. To avoid burnout, it must also be decently entertaining to herself without overwhelming stress as she perceives it. Good so far?

Now... if the only thing you can create some sort of many-hour-spanning stream narrative out of after MSQ is (briefly Savage, and then) Ultimate, then the chance of entertaining both self and audience without overwhelming stress... is limited to solely the most stressful content in the game (exempting minority reactions to say, seemingly unfair Triple Triad NPC fights).

Now, compare that to what would be relevant to her even as a full-time streamer / content creator... if there were more midcore content. See how those aren't likely to be all that separate of issues?

But at the same time, such would benefit the rest of us, too. What would help address her complaints wouldn't be an undue expense to the rest of us; it would probably be a boon.

As such, I don't see why her complaints about having less to do surrounding, say, Relic progression should be ignored just because she burned out or just because she's a XIV streamer. That seems a misread of the larger picture there, equivalent to mistaking a problem felt in (potentially reluctant) option A with being somehow unrelated to any issue in lacking any real options other than A.

I feel like we're both operating in good faith but are probably misunderstanding each other. To be clear, I don't think that Zepla's criticisms should be ignored. Rather, I think that whether or not a player enjoys any game — especially one with as much complexity and variety as FF14 — is a highly subjective experience. Someone who's here for the hardcore raiding is going to naturally have a different experience than someone who's here for crafting. Someone who plays for just a few hours on the weekend is going to have a different experience than someone who puts in several hours daily. These diverse players have different wants and needs, and these provide valuable context that relates to how satisfied they will be with the game or any given patch. In particular, burnout can often make a defining difference between enjoying something and hating it; I've seen it so many times, and experienced it as well.

So what I'm trying to suggest is that when people hear Zepla's criticisms of the game, they should also consider the context within which she makes her critique. Do not dismiss her! Just be thoughtful. That's really all I wanted to say.

[Koros]

I feel like we're both operating in good faith but are probably misunderstanding each other. To be clear, I don't think that Zepla's criticisms should be ignored. Rather, I think that whether or not a player enjoys any game — especially one with as much complexity and variety as FF14 — is a highly subjective experience. Someone who's here for the hardcore raiding is going to naturally have a different experience than someone who's here for crafting. Someone who plays for just a few hours on the weekend is going to have a different experience than someone who puts in several hours daily. These diverse players have different wants and needs, and these provide valuable context that relates to how satisfied they will be with the game or any given patch. In particular, burnout can often make a defining difference between enjoying something and hating it; I've seen it so many times, and experienced it as well.

So what I'm trying to suggest is that when people hear Zepla's criticisms of the game, they should also consider the context within which she makes her critique. Do not dismiss her! Just be thoughtful. That's really all I wanted to say.

Why are you guys debating about Zepla when it's a sentiment shared by MULTIPLE content creators, not just Zepla. Seems like she's just easier to attack so people choose that lmao

@ me when you guys try to explain why MrHappy should be ignored too. Oh wait sorry, not "ignore", just put into context so that it's super convenient to dismiss, but don't actually explicitly dismiss guys! Because that's not thoughtful. Just hint at dismissing. Wink wink.

[Aword3213]

Why are you guys debating about Zepla when it's a sentiment shared by MULTIPLE content creators, not just Zepla. Seems like she's just easier to attack so people choose that lmao

because, you know, Zepla is the topic of this very thread

@ me

which one?

[Sebazy]

Zepla gained my respect back when she was the only influencer to actually have the balls to go off script and push Yoshida about the steadily growing unrest over endgame healing. Perhaps it was a byproduct of the impending burnout but she seemed much more willing to burn her chances of getting future interviews than Mr Happy who was as spineless as ever at the time.

[Shurrikhan]

So what I'm trying to suggest is that when people hear Zepla's criticisms of the game, they should also consider the context within which she makes her critique. Do not dismiss her! Just be thoughtful. That's really all I wanted to say.

Unless the context would indicate a likely mismatch between what would benefit her and what would benefit many of us, more common camps of players, or some theoretical "average" player, though... a warning simply to "be thoughtful" of a tangential difference alone (that of background or playtime, which does not necessarily or even that likely indicate differences in priorities as they would affect the given suggestion)... that is effectively encouraging people just to dismiss it.

If you're feeling some likely mismatch there, then why not give your guess instead of just telling people to take the given opinion with a grain of salt? No one was assuming from the start that any other person's experience or preferences would perfectly match theirs; the question is how it would affect the feedback being responded to.

If it doesn't affect it (be that in its necessary prior supporting changes, the suggestion itself, or likely consequences of that suggestion), it's not going to be relevant to the suggestion's discussion.


I don't think you're intending it to be such, but that reads very much as an encouragement to dismiss or find the worse in a given idea over its speaker's tangential/unessential/irrelevant differences.

[LilimoLimomo]

a warning simply to "be thoughtful" off a tangential difference alone (that of background or playtime, which does not necessarily or even that likely indicate differences in priorities as they would affect the given suggestion)... that is effectively encouraging people just to dismiss it.

I guess this might be a difference of opinion? I felt like the difference you're describing as tangential was relevant to the topic at hand. If you genuinely think it's unrelated, I can understand why you would see what I'm saying as something akin to a disingenuous distraction that would at best function as a flimsy excuse to dismiss an opinion. To me it seemed pertinent, since burnout can have such a tangible impact upon what we enjoy versus what we dislike, as well as the way we criticize it. Or at least, that's my experience.

I still want people to listen to Zepla; she's a person I have respect for, and her words are worth hearing and genuinely considering. It's my personal opinion that knowing about her burnout can help those listening to her to have a more holistic understanding of the context in which she's making her measurements and her opinions. And I want to be explicit: nobody should be dismissing her due to this! That is not a fair reason to dismiss anyone; that would be ad hominem, which has no place in any reasonable discussion.

When I read your most recent reply to me, I get the impression that you believe that everyone (or perhaps most?) is already being thoughtful, unbiased, and critical when they receive new information. And if that is indeed the case, then perhaps that explains why my message would seem needless to you? A major part of why I made my initial post is that I am accustomed to a non-trivial segment of people becoming invested in their side of an issue and not really considering other perspectives. I feel like everyone is guilty of this at times, myself included, and I think that a reminder to be thoughtful and see the world as shades of grey rather than purely black and white can be helpful to a lot of people and discourse as a whole. That's where I'm coming from.

Even if we don't agree on things, I hope that clarifies were I'm coming from. And again, for anyone who needs it, don't dismiss Zepla or anyone else. Hear what they have to say. And if the context I added would encourage you to dismiss someone, then please ignore that context, because I'd rather you hear what she has to say in a less optimal manner than not hear it at all.

Edit: and you know what, I just re-read my initial post and I can see now how it can be interpreted in a dismissive way, which is not what I had in mind when I wrote it. I'mma try to fix it up a bit so it's less that way.

[tsuchii]

It's funny how when an influencer is mindlessly praising the game they're wielded as a bludgeon to dismiss critical feedback and yet when an influencer is expressing concern regarding the state of the game as an actual game suddenly their opinion is treated as irrelevant.

I can't stand streamers. I think they're one of the worst things to happen to gaming - but that aside, her concerns are very valid and shared by many here.

I don't mind them until they start behaving like they're some kind of blessing in this game. There are many of them and honestly, it's so cringe to watch.

NEWS FLASH - While their video views/popularity is decent, they are so contemptibly small compared to the actual player base of the game. Majority of the people I know in the game don't even watch content creators.

[Shurrikhan]

Edit: and you know what, I just re-read my initial post and I can see now how it can be interpreted in a dismissive way, which is not what I had in mind when I wrote it. I'mma try to fix it up a bit so it's less that way.

Sounds good! Tried to do a thumbs up emoji but... 90's forum design.

I get the impression that you believe that everyone (or perhaps most?) is already being thoughtful, unbiased, and critical when they receive new information. And if that is indeed the case, then perhaps that explains why my message would seem needless to you? A major part of why I made my initial post is that I am accustomed to a non-trivial segment of people becoming invested in their side of an issue and not really considering other perspectives.

I'm not quite so optimistic as all that; I just feel like the average person not only tends to drop critical thought in favor of oversimplified considerations of "Are they an outsider or insider?" but also will generally prefer, or be convinced/stimulated by, a reason to dismiss X than to engage with it (probably because it's just far less demanding). As such, I felt your particular tack would play on the worse tendencies of many in a way that would be very unproductive for the course of the thread. Glad to know that wasn't your intent.