Meaningless Battles...

[BaconBits]

All of you must pay for your pizza crimes WITH BLOOD.

[Mimilu]

Corn is actually good on pizza though.

Anti-corn pizza propaganda is made by pineapple pizza fans.

No.
No to both.
(๑-﹏-๑)

[Renalt]

I'm one of those people that think pizza is perfect cause you can put just about anything on it and make it work...

However if anyone ordered a mayo and corn pizza...I'm arriving with a molotov and not a pizza.

THE SICKNESS MUST BE PURGED!

[Kacho_Nacho]

I'm tempted to say "that's right" just to see how the other account reacts.

Deny nothing. Or deny everything. Doesn't matter, people will always believe what they really want to believe. Or what others trick them into believing.

joins you in sipping tea

Good plan.

Japan has very weird sense when it comes to pizza. Well, to my American brain…anyway.

Unless you really really like lots of mayonnaise with lukewarm corn.



On topic: I do wonder what the point of the Golbez situation actually is. If this is his one battle, and he lives, will he be redeemed in the end? Or will it be a solo duty thing? Or is Zeromus gonna eat him?

And (spoilers), what effect is this going to have on the first? If I understood Y’shtola correctly..she’s..going to…weaponize.. the empty?

There's one made with corn and mayo too? Oh gods...

Back on topic!

I have no idea what's up with Golbez. I'm hoping he gets eaten by Zeromus.

Yeah, I wonder what's going to happen when the Empty meets the Void. What's going to happen to all three worlds? Y'shtola's plan can be seen as brilliant or insanely reckless.

I guess it all depends on if the writers are going to be consistent with what we know occurs when something big happens in a reflection or if it's going to layered with so much plot armor that we all collectively throw our hands up in the air.

[Boblawblah]

note: I did not read all 10 pages.

Unwinnable fights are very difficult to do well.

- wasting resources
- have to hit a dps check only to lose AFTER you meet the dps check, but if you don't meet the dps check, you really lose and have to restart (looking at you FFXVI, a trick they picked up from FFXIV and other games)
- main character cutscene fumbling and suddenly can't swing their sword without falling down (FFXVI again!)
- fight seems easy until the inevitable one shot

They're just very difficult to do well without it feeling cheap, or that you were tricked. Souls games are pretty good about it, they give you an honest challenge, and if you pass it, you get a reward (souls, or an item, something), but you still "lose". Games that actually let you straight up beat the final boss early like Renalt mention are awesome, but again, they can harm a game experience if someone beat the game way earlier than expected (Prey early ending is an example of a ending ruining the proper gameplay experience).

off topic: Korea also has weird pizza. Check out this white sauce based pizza with sweet potato/cheese crust on the edge. It's so ridiculously good

[Kacho_Nacho]

Corn is actually good on pizza though.

Anti-corn pizza propaganda is made by pineapple pizza fans.

I'm not anti-corn. In fact, I like on a tex-mex style pizza. (Don't knock it. If you love enchiladas, tacos or tamales, you'll like a "mexican" pizza.)

It's the mayonnaise which throws me off. The thought eating it hot just doesn't appeal to me and I'm one of those individuals who will try any culinary dish at least once.

I like pineapple on pizza but it has to be paired with the right toppings, such as barbecued chicken. My spouse, however, hates it.

note: I did not read all 10 pages.

Unwinnable fights are very difficult to do well.

- wasting resources
- have to hit a dps check only to lose AFTER you meet the dps check, but if you don't meet the dps check, you really lose and have to restart (looking at you FFXVI, a trick they picked up from FFXIV and other games)
- main character cutscene fumbling and suddenly can't swing their sword without falling down (FFXVI again!)
- fight seems easy until the inevitable one shot

They're just very difficult to do well without it feeling cheap, or that you were tricked. Souls games are pretty good about it, they give you an honest challenge, and if you pass it, you get a reward (souls, or an item, something), but you still "lose". Games that actually let you straight up beat the final boss early like Renalt mention are awesome, but again, they can harm a game experience if someone beat the game way earlier than expected (Prey early ending is an example of a ending ruining the proper gameplay experience).

off topic: Korea also has weird pizza. Check out this white sauce based pizza with sweet potato/cheese crust on the edge. It's so ridiculously good

You know, I love Korean cooking. I'd try that pizza. Got the recipe at hand?

Back on topic:

I don't think the issues are with unwinnable fights. In fact, I think it's good to remind the players that there is always someone better.

The issue is how it is presented. It is tremendously unfair to the player to have a cut scene take away a victory when the player has been winning the entire fight.

What we do should always matter and it's not difficult to have an ending where the player wins, and another where the player loses, and have the two forks in the road join together a short while later.

[Alleo]

Boss fights you're supposed to lose have been in RPGs for the past 30+ years and SE aren't the only ones to do it. Elden Ring even begins with one. It's just a narrative tool and I don't really see a problem with it unless it's an RPG with items and I end up wasting them, not knowing I was supposed to lose.

I think something like that is fine when you are starting out with your adventure or if the enemy has some unknown fighting mechanic that takes us by surprise. Fordola is someone like that with her echo.

I really dont like it, if its simply for plot. For example Zenos...he beats us quite easily (we are already seasoned warriors at that time) and somehow a few levels later we not only beat him but Shinryu. Our character may have gained exp while going through the story but that is a gameplay mechanic. We had not gone through real months of training. We did not research something that will help us beat him. We just did, because it was time to do it.

At least if we are meant to lose make it so that it makes sense. Poison us with something unknown, let us take a hit that was meant for one of our friends, that we otherwise would have not taken. Anything like that.

And I fully agree with the OP about our character just not doing much afterwards or the fight not meaning much. Cutscene WoL is honestly the worst. There are too many scenes where stuff happens because our WoL turns into a level 1 warrior again, with the reaction time of a slug. Like a deer caught in the car lights.

[TheMightyMollusk]

Another problem is that the opponent we're losing to has to actually feel like a credible threat. If we're effortlessly stomping mudholes in them until the plot kicks in, it's unsatisfying at best.

As an example, Kai Leng in Mass Effect 3. The game talks him up like a super badass assassin, a sort of anti-Shepard who should be a deadly adversary. In his appearances in the novels, he even lives up to it (perhaps barring Deception, which.....let's just say even BioWare disowns that one). But then he gets on screen, and:

-Barely escapes a one-on-one fight with Thane, who is in the terminal phase of Kepral's Syndrome (short version: his lungs are dying, he can barely breath without considerable pain, never mind fight). Even after fatally wounding the already half-dead Thane, he flees as soon as Shepard's squad comes to join the fight, failing his mission to kill the salarian Councilor. Thane even mocks him for it on his deathbed.

-On Thessia, Leng is a pathetic excuse for a fight; it's quite easily possible to take no damage at all from him until he calls in gunship support. Leng himself is never a real threat in this fight. And it eventually ends on a cut scene. Oh, and the petty little prick sends a taunting email afterwards.

-Finally, on Kronos Station, Leng calls in teams of flunkies to help....and they're far more dangerous than he is. He's a slightly-buffed Phantom, but without the instant-kill melee attack. (For extra irony, some of the mooks he calls in are actual Phantoms.) At least this time you actually get to kill him.

Overall, there are a lot of reasons why Leng's considered one of the worst characters in the franchise, and his underwhelming boss fights are a big part of it.

[Boblawblah]

Another problem is that the opponent we're losing to has to actually feel like a credible threat. If we're effortlessly stomping mudholes in them until the plot kicks in, it's unsatisfying at best.

As an example, Kai Leng in Mass Effect 3. The game talks him up like a super badass assassin, a sort of anti-Shepard who should be a deadly adversary. In his appearances in the novels, he even lives up to it (perhaps barring Deception, which.....let's just say even BioWare disowns that one). But then he gets on screen, and:

-Barely escapes a one-on-one fight with Thane, who is in the terminal phase of Kepral's Syndrome (short version: his lungs are dying, he can barely breath without considerable pain, never mind fight). Even after fatally wounding the already half-dead Thane, he flees as soon as Shepard's squad comes to join the fight, failing his mission to kill the salarian Councilor. Thane even mocks him for it on his deathbed.

-On Thessia, Leng is a pathetic excuse for a fight; it's quite easily possible to take no damage at all from him until he calls in gunship support. Leng himself is never a real threat in this fight. And it eventually ends on a cut scene. Oh, and the petty little prick sends a taunting email afterwards.

-Finally, on Kronos Station, Leng calls in teams of flunkies to help....and they're far more dangerous than he is. He's a slightly-buffed Phantom, but without the instant-kill melee attack. (For extra irony, some of the mooks he calls in are actual Phantoms.) At least this time you actually get to kill him.

Overall, there are a lot of reasons why Leng's considered one of the worst characters in the franchise, and his underwhelming boss fights are a big part of it.

That email from Leng felt like the devs were just memeing at that point. "lul, you opened the message, it is I KAI LENG! You're a poopy head!".

[Renalt]

We don't talk about Kai Leng here...or anywhere.