I'll Forever be Bronze

[Bluish]

I can definitely vouch for the casual toxicity, there have been some quite extraordinary cases. From 3-minute-long "Push the Crystal spam" (R.I.P. my ears) to "Hello", "Hello", "Hello" salt from dying while overextending like a true hero.

Granted I use the ignore1 mark liberally to tell people who do that off and occasionally drop it on some call-active hero who dives 1v5 when I ask them to fall back like 7 times in a row. But yeah there definitely has been a rise of that in casual.

I'm really not okay with people getting marked regardless to what they do, if you wanna help, mark targets to focus in the enemy team, and if you have something to tell people who dive in kamikaze style then send them a tell... Most people will not know why they are getting marked while some just don't care while it's still impacts moral of the whole team. Either way marking a team member as target to ignore is the most dog awful thing I see people do in cc. If your team member is suicidal, mark them with the target to bind, as I have seen people do, and pop a macro that wil tell others to try and cover that player. Just imagine if everyone felt they had the right to command their team and punish individuals who don't obey... My response to being marked as a target to ignore (being temperamental) is either behave as a target to ignore or mark everyone else in my team so I don't feel lonely. I mean if the player is really just there to mess up every match on purpose, you might want to report them, but if they have been harassed by you with markers, you have no grounds to complain, literally 0. People rush ahead right from the start with little consideration to others following...they are often not team conscious but those that focus too much on their team are just the other side of the extreme. Ain't no one looking back at their journey through cc is gonna think, oh I'm so thankful for all ignore markers, I would never get better without them!

[Reinhardt_Azureheim]

-snip-

For starters, you are thinking WAY too deep into this. The ignore marker for reckless diving over and over I remove as soon as they are out of the danger or respawn, I ALREADY use bind markers for things like a Cover macro or marking enemies to be wary of or to disrupt. I also do interact with players after matches in the most tame way possible by slowly breaching the topic.

In fact, I shotcall and mark enemy players to be focused, I use more hotbar spaces for callouts than for combat - I am already doing far above average what I should do. But to clarify when I use Ignore1/2:

• someone just respawned, we have more than enough time and advantage and we just need people to respawn and they dive 1v5, more than four times in a match. Why do I use Ignore1? Because it is way more noticeable. Idgaf if you or anyone else might consider it aggravating, if I see someone going on a suicide mission when I spam to Fall Back I will use this marker to get their attention.
• for similar reasons, someone who starts spamming "Push the Crystal", "Good Match" or "Nice Job" I will put it up to at least give a signal that they should stop. If they don't stop, I will ask them after the match to stop. If they continue I'll report.
• Samurai with LB up and Chiten not seen recently used. I keep track of it a lot of times.

You can disagree all you want, this is up to you, but I am not going to change what I do if people around me either are bad actors (spammers) or continuously make the terrible decision to be a wannabe hero only to get shot down in a second flat when asked not to. These markings arent harassment, these are "please stop" signals. If you are neither of this, then you being in my matches should be a complete non-issue.

The ignore markers exist, I will use them and I don't care how people feel about this.

[HyperiusUltima]

There is no easy answer to this for the simple reason that ranged jobs depend heavily on the non ranged jobs of your team. If those get overrun/overwhelmed, or just don't care or play properly, your backlines suddenly become wide open and you get melees running rampant everywhere. When this happens it's a losing battle, because ranged jobs for most of them are the better jobs at applying AoE/damage pressure, but are hard countered by a lot of melees (esp MNK, SAM, RPR, DRG, or even more occasional ones like LB WAR, or DPS GNB). If you do not get support from your team, it's already a win for the melees because they're denying your team more than you're denying them if they keep you busy fighting them and eventually potentially dying.

Shaking melees off your back is usually a delicate balance of not getting exposed yourself to the enemy ranged (attracting all fire like melees usually do, except you're not a melee able to sustain that), and not fleeing away from your team, leaving you extremely exposed. The trick is to make the enemy melees over commit on you and delay as much as you can with your tools (Guard, Purify, Recuperate, Warden's and Repelling on BRD, etc) until your buddies managed to kill the melee or shake them off. Good melee players at higher levels are actually very good at picking off lone targets by harassing backlines, and if your team doesn't help you then everybody loses (which happens even at crystal because a lot of melee players think that if you die to someone else as a ranged, you deserve to die, which is stupid).

This is what I do think that no matter the ranged job, even if fully designed for DPS/cc like SMN, BLM, MCH, you're still inherently part support and cannot function on your own, unlike a team of melees/healers.



BRD is still a perfectly capable job even if the nerf hurt.

Also no, MCH is NOT a carry job by far. People don't realize how it relies heavily on a good team, for the simple reason that the job strives on opportunities and ticks around those hard. If your team doesn't allow you opportunities for targets to snipe/secure kill, then your job value plummets down to oblivion. But it's a good job though for sure.

Thank you for the advice. I’ll make sure to work on it this afternoon. I just was struggling with the concept on HOW I should position when there’s a ton of ways to do so.

[HyperiusUltima]

1. Generally, yes. I always advise new players in PvP to start out playing ranged jobs because it teaches you the very important skill of positioning, and how drastically it can affect your games. As a rule of thumb starting out as a new player, never be in front of your tank or melee... EVER. Not even to push the crystal (unless you are losing in overtime). Stay behind your melee and tank until you learn the caveats where it is okay to push beyond them.

If you have no melee or tank on your team, that is also fine and the same concept applies. Stay ranged and dont push the crystal until your team is at a numbers advantage. Let the enemy approach you even if they pushed into you 15-30%. It wont matter if you wipe them and push it to 50. As long as you are 5v5, pushing the crystal is the last thing you need to be thinking about. Land a kill first, then check your party's mana. If they are all above 50%, then you can push. If they are below 50% call for them to fall back and drink first... then push.

This advice is tailored to you as a newer player. These are not hardset rules and will change over time as you rank higher and gain more experience.

2. You can't always pick the optinal Paen target. Of course, do your best and continue to learn and get better at it. However I would advise you to just keep it on cooldown until you start to see the patterns of the optimal target.

You can use Paen preemptively before your target even gets hit by CC. And it will auto nullify the CC for your target.

I really do hope you find success, and I think it would be great to see a more diverse cast of players in the higher ranks of play. Currently, it is quite boring playing against the same players over and over. But I digress.

By the way Sinstrel, if you have Discord I’ll record a few matches in one video. Are you in the PvPrimal Discord by chance?

[Bluish]

-snap-

What I mean is there is no point in using the target to ignore on your team members. You can always try to talk to the person you noticed has some patience issue or whatever AFTER the match. What you are doing is shaming person for either behaviour they are not aware is incorrect or behaviour they are perfectly aware is incorrect but alas THEY dgaf...

I find it's best to have no more than 2 markers on the battlefield and with too many call-outs I tune out and stick with my own judgment, purely because it's distracting more than it's helpful. Target to ignore on a team member only points out that one of my other team buddies has control issues. Ideally I would like to see markers only on the enemy team, that's the only way they make sense to me.

We need "please stop" command because target to ignore just doesn't quite covey what you are using it for. It has some relevance in case of chat spammers but please trust me your other team members will know to ignore them without the mark and the spammers themselves have control issues, clearly, and it ends in what you would actually get when fighting fire with fire.

We can agree to disagree.

[Valence]

I'm really not okay with people getting marked regardless to what they do, if you wanna help, mark targets to focus in the enemy team, and if you have something to tell people who dive in kamikaze style then send them a tell... Most people will not know why they are getting marked while some just don't care while it's still impacts moral of the whole team. Either way marking a team member as target to ignore is the most dog awful thing I see people do in cc. If your team member is suicidal, mark them with the target to bind, as I have seen people do, and pop a macro that wil tell others to try and cover that player. Just imagine if everyone felt they had the right to command their team and punish individuals who don't obey... My response to being marked as a target to ignore (being temperamental) is either behave as a target to ignore or mark everyone else in my team so I don't feel lonely. I mean if the player is really just there to mess up every match on purpose, you might want to report them, but if they have been harassed by you with markers, you have no grounds to complain, literally 0. People rush ahead right from the start with little consideration to others following...they are often not team conscious but those that focus too much on their team are just the other side of the extreme. Ain't no one looking back at their journey through cc is gonna think, oh I'm so thankful for all ignore markers, I would never get better without them!

I do agree on everything.

I've used it recently in one or two occasion with somebody being especially obnoxious with quickchat in casual, and it seemed to have shut them up immediately... Not sure what to think about it so far.

Quickchat could be reworked in many ways for sure. Some commands just don't make sense to be available during games (like hello, or good match for example). Some commands are just not there, like "help" or "clear comms", idk.

[Myrha_Lhlalheva]

By the way Sinstrel, if you have Discord I’ll record a few matches in one video. Are you in the PvPrimal Discord by chance?

If you'd like to learn BRD I'd also be more than happy to help, you can add nadoP on discord. I know it sounds like a huge boast but I've worked very hard to become the best BRD on Primal, so I think I have a thing or two to teach.

[Bluish]

I do agree on everything.

I've used it recently in one or two occasion with somebody being especially obnoxious with quickchat in casual, and it seemed to have shut them up immediately... Not sure what to think about it so far.

Quickchat could be reworked in many ways for sure. Some commands just don't make sense to be available during games (like hello, or good match for example). Some commands are just not there, like "help" or "clear comms", idk.

Yea, chat spammers be chat spamming and that's the only way to tell them short of actually telling them. This one got the message. I'm glad we agree on wishing for less aversive means.

It would be so much less of a problem if some commands were only available at the beginning and after the battle, you are right that we are missing a few too. I would like a "help" command. I also wish that they would actually keep us there for solid 10 seconds after each match so that everyone will look at the scoreboard and maybe even get a chance to commend each other or just spam the chat to the heart's content.

[Sinstrel]

By the way Sinstrel, if you have Discord I’ll record a few matches in one video. Are you in the PvPrimal Discord by chance?

Hi Hyperius,

I am not part of any of the discord PvP communities but have still made it to top 30/top 100 multiple times. I have also coached my sister and FC members to crystal and top 100.

I am more than happy to review your videos and give you honest advice and feedback. You can still find me on discord through direct message by sending me a friend request. My discord handle is just Sinstrel and a fan art portrait of my character.

Looking forward to hearing from you!

[RajNish]

These markings arent harassment

2. Taunting/Abusive behaviour

・Persistently placing a negative target marker on another ally player


https://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes...feef4e8feec50e