Nidhogg!?

[ThePatriarch]

That's what I said, adding such content would only make things worse, because people would need to level the playing field.

Bot vs bot.

We should just stop making content altogether with that mentality.

[Lux_Rayna]

We should just stop making content altogether with that mentality.

What a gross and overly dramatic exaggeration lol. Seriously?

Without open world HNM's guess what? Botting doesn't matter a whole lot. When you start adding claims and special things in which botting *really* shines, it becomes a widespread problem. Remove incentives to bot, botting isn't a big issue. Add incentives for illegal 3rd party programs and guess what? They are everywhere, and they become a real problem since they directly affect competition.

There is no good reason for the silly claim competitions some ppl are clamoring for. It will just blow the doors wide open for everyone to abuse their botting practices to the fullest, and even for non-botters to get bots just to compete. Its not a terribly concept to understand. Yes there's botting already but what does it affect really? Nothing. It has no effect on competition, does not prevent anyone from advancing, it just lets one guy play without playing. So what? Doesn't really impact the game in its current form in any way. Add claims and it impacts everyone's game due to unfair competition.

[Elexia]

What a gross and overly dramatic exaggeration lol. Seriously?

Without open world HNM's guess what? Botting doesn't matter a whole lot. When you start adding claims and special things in which botting *really* shines, it becomes a widespread problem. Remove incentives to bot

You need to remove these things from FFXIV then:

-Leveling
-Crafting
-Ability to make gil
-Ability to spend gil
-Questing
-Monsters
-Don't incorporate PvP
-Targetable triggers (i.e if there's an event that requires x amount of people to touch to get a special gift, i.e treasure hunt, this is botted as well)

Face it, HNMs don't create botting, MMORPGs in general creates botting,

[Lux_Rayna]

You need to remove these things from FFXIV then:

Here we go more exaggerations.

-Leveling

Does not affect my gameplay.

-Crafting

Does not affect my gameplay.

-Ability to make gil

Does not affect my gameplay

-Ability to spend gil

Does not affect my gameplay

-Questing

Does not affect my gameplay

-Monsters

Does not affect my gameplay normally.
Can affect my gameplay if we include HNMS with long timers and claims.

-Don't incorporate PvP

You cannot bot in pvp or you will get pwned. Does not affect my gameplay.

-Targetable triggers (i.e if there's an event that requires x amount of people to touch to get a special gift, i.e treasure hunt, this is botted as well)

Does not affect my gameplay either.

Face it, HNMs don't create botting, MMORPGs in general creates botting,

Never said it did. HNMs is just the only circumstance that severely affects everyone's gameplay and prevents others from accessing content they *should* have access to. You entirely missed the point. Botting in every other circumstance is just personal cheating, which in no way affects me at all. Add HNM's and botting is cheating that *does* affect me and everyone else who's trying to compete fairly.

[Elexia]

Here we go more exaggerations..

You cannot bot in pvp or you will get pwned. Does not affect my gameplay.

Oh? But I thought content created the need to Bot? Guess your MMO experience is pretty limited, because botting/hacking in PvP is the main use bots and hacks get in competitive MMOs.

Also:

Add HNM's and botting is cheating that *does* affect me and everyone else who's trying to compete fairly.

How does HNMs affect your gameplay when PvP doesn't? For one to talk about exaggerations, you seem to be in a weird line of thinking that a gameplay feature would have less of an effect on you than an optional monster to kill.

[Lux_Rayna]

Oh? But I thought content created the need to Bot? Guess your MMO experience is pretty limited, because botting/hacking in PvP is the main use bots and hacks get in competitive MMOs.

Nothing creates the need to bot. Ppl bot just because ppl bot, content can only further encourage or discourage botting. And hacking is entirely different from botting, and is not the subject of this discussion. Nice try sneaking that in there but no. Hacking is a different beast altogether, although like botting hacking doesn't really affect you except for certain circumstances.

I've done a looot of pvp, and botting had no affect on me. There is not alot you can do with a bot that normal ppl couldnt do as far as pvp is concerned, and the advantage it gives is relatively small. Sure you can bot heal yourself so you dont have to do it, but a good pvp player could do that anyway just as effectively.

Hacking obviously breaks pvp altogether, but we are not talking about hacking.

How does HNMs affect your gameplay when PvP doesn't? For one to talk about exaggerations, you seem to be in a weird line of thinking that a gameplay feature would have less of an effect on you than an optional monster to kill.

PvP is optional as well. Whats your point? As I've already discussed, botting in pvp offers very little advantage. It gives you convenience, and makes you less prone to error, but a "good" player is not very prone to error anyway. A bot cannot beat a good player regularly just because its a bot. A bot will beat a "good" player at an HNM spawn precisely because it is a bot. HNMs and PvP are entirely different, thus botting has different effects on both of them. I can pwn a botter at PvP, I can't beat a botter to an HNM claim no matter what I do. The advantages of botting on HNMs are far more than the advantages of botting for PvP.

For someone with so much experience you should know this anyway. I don't know why im even explaining it.

[Jinko]

We should just stop making content altogether with that mentality.

How so ?

You can still make pop style triggers and instance style content.

Do you mean it has to be your way or no way ?