2 minute burst window vs fight design

[RyuDragnier]

Some players were just not there during the days of HW when MNK was not taken when there was a DRK in the party due to both having an Int debuff (MNK's was on Dragon Kick), how DRG was MANDATORY if you had a BRD/MCH due to the piercing debuff, and how NIN basically invalidated one of WAR's combos because if the slash debuff they both did. Then there was also AST either making WHM not taken due to Diurnal being so strong, or SCH being dropped because Nocturnal was so strong. And then there was PLD being useless against magic bosses because back then they couldn't guard magic damage with Sheltron, making DRK mandatory.

We've seen how bad disparity can get, which is also why the devs started moving away from that.

Well everyone's of the same consensus that they're sick of being forced into the "2 Minute Meta" which the developers did - that nobody asked for.

You mean the playerbase DIDN'T ask for some of the buffs to be 60s, 30s, or 2m so they could fit into the burst windows easier? Because I distinctly recall a LOT of threads asking for that back in the day.

[Mithron]

Some players were just not there during the days of HW when MNK was not taken when there was a DRK in the party due to both having an Int debuff (MNK's was on Dragon Kick), how DRG was MANDATORY if you had a BRD/MCH due to the piercing debuff, and how NIN basically invalidated one of WAR's combos because if the slash debuff they both did. Then there was also AST either making WHM not taken due to Diurnal being so strong, or SCH being dropped because Nocturnal was so strong. And then there was PLD being useless against magic bosses because back then they couldn't guard magic damage with Sheltron, making DRK mandatory.

We've seen how bad disparity can get, which is also why the devs started moving away from that.

I was there. I'd rather deal with that than how bad fight design and mechanics are now.

[RyuDragnier]

I was there. I'd rather deal with that than how bad fight design and mechanics are now.

So you'd prefer to be useless against magic as a PLD again and be dropped because you're worthless in several raid fight in a tier? You'd like for your RDM to be thrown out of a group because its burst doesn't align with 90s raid buff cooldowns that the party is aligning around?

[Absimiliard]

So you'd prefer to be useless against magic as a PLD again and be dropped because you're worthless in several raid fight in a tier? You'd like for your RDM to be thrown out of a group because its burst doesn't align with 90s raid buff cooldowns that the party is aligning around?

PLD and RDM are already intentionally excluded anyway. Scrapping the two-minute burst meta wouldn't do them any favors, yeah, but they're already getting screwed.

Frankly, to me, the meta seems to be a huge source of stagnation for endgame fight design. Trying to force everything to work with it has resulted in an incredible amount of job homogenization and a decrease in fight mechanics that are creative or fun in favor of bosses having a spameurysm every couple minute.

[RyuDragnier]

PLD and RDM are already intentionally excluded anyway. Scrapping the two-minute burst meta wouldn't do them any favors, yeah, but they're already getting screwed.

Frankly, to me, the meta seems to be a huge source of stagnation for endgame fight design. Trying to force everything to work with it has resulted in an incredible amount of job homogenization and a decrease in fight mechanics that are creative or fun in favor of bosses having a spameurysm every couple minute.

Unfortunately, the players make the meta, so it's the players fault things come to this. They'll never be appeased.