Bard nerf is garbage

[Valence]

No, that nocturne nerf was needed. It was constant abused and they could constantly hit you from Narnia, while also doing damage with it? Too much, you have no idea how many bards were so over reliant on that ability.

Let me guess, you play ranged jobs?

[flowerfairy]

The range nerf was overkill. Otherwise I'm fine with BRD leaning more into sustained damage than burst, I think it compliments its long duration team buffs

[Nubrication]

I play bard a lot and have done for a while now so bit disappointed at the new changes. I do not like close combat even in PVE I always play ranged. I loved Dancer but it feels off in pvp and this kind of reminds me of that.

DNC is not meant to be played at far range in PVP. It’s meant to be played in melee/mid-range AND it’s toolkit (weaponskills/abilities/LB) supports it.

[Nubrication]

No, that nocturne nerf was needed. It was constant abused and they could constantly hit you from Narnia, while also doing damage with it? Too much, you have no idea how many bards were so over reliant on that ability.

How is it abused when their entire burst relies on it? Without it, they basically just do damage that can easily be recuperated from. You think Bard’s burst does massive damage? Bard’s burst is not a 1 button wonder, it’s initiated by silence and then emp arrow and pp - that’s plenty of time to purify and recuperate if you’re a good player (meaning you’re not oblivious). Emp arrow at max stacks by itself does a whopping 12000 dmg unbuffed by apex. Compare that to any other dps class support or not. Even healers have a higher dmg output.

[Luluna]

DNC is not meant to be played at far range in PVP. It’s meant to be played in melee/mid-range AND it’s toolkit (weaponskills/abilities/LB) supports it.

Yeh I haven't really played much of DNC in there tbh. On the odd occasion I have seen some really good Dancers in there and I wonder how they get the high numbers and watch in awe lol!

[DioK]

No, that nocturne nerf was needed. It was constant abused and they could constantly hit you from Narnia, while also doing damage with it? Too much, you have no idea how many bards were so over reliant on that ability.

Then here's a little thing that you may not have realized, and I can site evidence for it directly from the job guide (https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/jobguide/redmage/#pvp). Red mage has an ability (Resolution) that, if they go into white stance, also does a silence, and it's EVEN WORSE! It has the same 20 second cooldown time as Silent Nocturne, does 8000 potency damage (compared to Silent Nocturne's 2000) to everyone in a line (compared to Silent Nocturne's single target) for 25 yalms, with a 25 yalm target range. That skill is unchanged, even though it's a far more damaging and potent skill. That same skill, alternatively, can do a bind effect in the same manner if the red mage is in black stance.

Now why did you see bard using its silence skill more than red mage using the silence version of their skill? For bard, Silent Nocturne was absolutely necessary to initiate burst and have a chance to secure the kill. Red mage does not need its silence skill for such, as it has more options. Further, the bind effect was more useful to red mage and the red mage's team to lock targets in place to allow the red mage and its team to gap-close on the targets and burst them down. For the red mage, it's useful (that is, a play option); for the bard, it's necessary (you don’t have a choice but to use it, if you want to be anything other than just a 10% damage buff totem).

Bard was designed, fundamentally, to play from a far distance. That fundamental design has not changed; however now, the class is being shackled to play close to be an effective participant in the battle (i.e., not be just a buff totem). Coupled with the fact the class is not given survivability to play in close (the way DNC was eventually modified), and the class now suffers from conflicting design priorities, which means neither priority will be satisfied for the vast majority of the time, leading to a highly underperforming class (which bard already, inherently, struggled to match damage of other classes because it's most powerful single attack is conditioned on building it up and, yet, is from 4000 to 24000 potency less than equivalent attacks for other classes). Under the current patch, bard, in order to have the same effectiveness it did prior, MUST play EXACTLY on the 15 yalm circle, no closer and no farther. If you play close, your skills lose damage because an inherent range-based damage drop-off. If you play far, you lose damage cause your getting Pitch Perfect (an 8000 potency skill) only half the time, because you lost the Silent Nocturne initiation. It's only exactly on that 15 yalm circle do you not suffer any damage losses (what other class in PvP is inherently designed to lose damage due to battle situation; bard is already a low damage class, yet, it is inherently designed to lose damage based on battle situations). But then, bard runs into the problem that any bard playing at 15 yalms or less, due to lacking survivability, is generally quickly dead and serves no purpose other than to provide the enemy team with battle-high.

The change was poorly thought out and shows that SE does not understand, at all, the class they designed.

I still play bard in PvP, because I’m just that much a die-hard bard player. It's what I like to play and what I have fun with. I even played bard back when we had the walking bug from using Powerful Shot after Apex Arrow (bard was the ONLY class that had that issue). However, let me tell you, bard is nowhere near as effective. I've gone from getting 7, 8, even as many as 12 kills, regularly, in a match to struggling just to eke out even 1-2 kills. I've gone from pushing out 800k+ damage over the match to struggling to achieve 300-400k. I think anyone who plays bard regularly in PvP can feel it, the struggle, now, to make the class work and be effective as something more than just a team totem. But, I’ll still play it, despite the frustration, cause bard is what I like to play.

[Ransu]

The range nerf was overkill. Otherwise I'm fine with BRD leaning more into sustained damage than burst, I think it compliments its long duration team buffs

Except CC is designed around burst... Sustained damage is nearly worthless in a mode that's usually over in less than 2 minutes.

[Nubrication]

Yeh I haven't really played much of DNC in there tbh. On the odd occasion I have seen some really good Dancers in there and I wonder how they get the high numbers and watch in awe lol!

Here are some free tips that’ll make your dmg output astronomically better if you decide to use DNC. *In regards to CC

1. Closed Position with your tank or melee. My usual dance partner priority is a good player that I recognize > melee carry or tank > healer that is good at pushing crystal. I do it in this order because that’s the order of who is probably going to be fighting at or near the crystal, letting me capitalize on my DNC toolkit while also fighting near objective. I almost never dance partner with a ranged dps unless they are a good player.

2. Never be the first to go in because you are still squishy without buffs.

3. Make sure that you use fan dance before you go in for honing dance (after fan dance - go in for honing dance). This gives you a total of -35% damage taken. Increasing your survivability at melee range.

There are definitely waaaay more caveats, more weaponskills/abilities involved and situational aspects but in general, you’ll notice that you’ll be harder to kill and deal more damage.

[flowerfairy]

Sustained damage is nearly worthless in a mode that's usually over in less than 2 minutes.

If that was true, maybe SCH wouldn’t have gotten nerfed

BRD still has a lot for it going on… Like I said, the range nerf was overkill, but the silence is still there which is the most important part of the burst. The 2k potency was ticklish at best.

[Ransu]

If that was true, maybe SCH wouldn’t have gotten nerfed

BRD still has a lot for it going on… Like I said, the range nerf was overkill, but the silence is still there which is the most important part of the burst. The 2k potency was ticklish at best.

You're forced to use repelling shot in your burst now. So they are forced to go into melee range and then forced to use their escape in a scenario that normally wouldn't be necessary. It's just a bad change all around. Remove the potency and reduce the duration, but they should have never nerfed its range.

And the burst meta is true. Sustain just isn't good in such a fast pace mode. The mode itself is short on top of things like recuperate being a thing. Its why using fire on BLM is nine times out of ten a dumb thing to do because burst/cc is way more important and since fire and ice do the same base damage, the "sustained" damage from the dot from fire is completely worthless.

I can't really comment on SCH burst as I don't play it, but their shield's are super annoying lol.