Dark Knight dungeon survivability suggestion

[Oizen]

What does need looking at imo is the overtuned party support.
Because while Warrior's selfhealing isn't all that impressive in content where it actually matters, the ability to provide that healing to your healers and dps, who already take no consistent damage, has a much bigger impact and unlike Paladin, Gunbreaker or Dark Knight you can provide that at barely any cost to yourself.

Ok but have you actually read Nascent flash.

Because in terms of overtuned party support, its wayyyyyyyy more impactful than TBN or Intervention.

[Absurdity]

Ok but have you actually read Nascent flash.

Because in terms of overtuned party support, its wayyyyyyyy more impactful than TBN or Intervention.

What does need looking at imo is the overtuned party support.
Because while Warrior's selfhealing isn't all that impressive in content where it actually matters, the ability to provide that healing to your healers and dps, who already take no consistent damage, has a much bigger impact and unlike Paladin, Gunbreaker or Dark Knight you can provide that at barely any cost to yourself.

Read what I said again...slowly.

[Oizen]

Ah I see what you mean by that now, my bad. The thing I don't understand about Nascent flash is why it basically is a double dip of Bloodwhetting, its not like the other 3 skills even give the tank who use it a buff for using it on someone else. DRK isn't getting self shields for using TBN on someone else, nor is GNB or PLD.
I think because of how insane Nascent is WAR is a stupidly strong off tank this tier, where every 25s outside of any tankswaps you should be mashing Nascent on the MT and it'll go a long way to bolster survivability for free.

But honestly the thing I don't like the idea of is "the content doesnt have to be balanced" because its easy.
Because It does affect things that are often overlooked for balancing, things like Deep Dungeons and now Criterion. They've also nerfed things like old Abyssal Drain spam for doing shit worse than Bloodwhetting does now, and I'm hoping that happens again rather than ignoring it, or worse homogenizing the other tanks to be able to do this as well.

[Absurdity]

Ah I see what you mean by that now, my bad. The thing I don't understand about Nascent flash is why it basically is a double dip of Bloodwhetting, its not like the other 3 skills even give the tank who use it a buff for using it on someone else. DRK isn't getting self shields for using TBN on someone else, nor is GNB or PLD.
I think because of how insane Nascent is WAR is a stupidly strong off tank this tier, where every 25s outside of any tankswaps you should be mashing Nascent on the MT and it'll go a long way to bolster survivability for free.

But honestly the thing I don't like the idea of is "the content doesnt have to be balanced" because its easy.
Because It does affect things that are often overlooked for balancing, things like Deep Dungeons and now Criterion. They've also nerfed things like old Abyssal Drain spam for doing shit worse than Bloodwhetting does now, and I'm hoping that happens again rather than ignoring it, or worse homogenizing the other tanks to be able to do this as well.

I think it's simply a case of them already having Nascent Flash as a finished ability from ShB and they just couldn't be bothered to rework it.

As for Abyssal Drain, I don't think it has anything to do with how strong the healing was in dungeons that made them rework it. It simply didn't work anymore with the new kit after they redesigned DrK's MP economy, completely removed the ability to augment skills and implemented a new aoe spender.

Why do I think that? Because at the same time as they removed old Abyssal they gave Warrior Nascent Flash which works on a similar principle and also healed for every instance of damage.

To get the most out of Nascent Flash you needed to time it correctly to get the most damage possible inside that window, to get the most out of old Abyssal Drain you needed to manage your MP to augment it with DA and you needed to manage your blood to get the most out of Blood Weapon's MP regen.

Now both weren't rocket science but they required at least an understanding of how your job kit functioned. Which is also why I'm not a fan of Bloodwhetting and NF having fixed potencies, you could press Heavy Swing 4 times and get the same value out of it as someone who actually knows what they're doing. Instead of being rewarded for proper play you now get rewarded for just pressing any button.

[Derio]

DRK dungeon survivability is fine. It gives the healers the ability to do more than just spam their one aoe damage skill because they would actually have to heal the tank.

[ed3891]

You could solo dungeon bosses on all tanks long before Endwalker.

In HW you had Bloodbath for all tanks, DA+Abyssal Drain (the non garbage version), Clemency and in tank stance Warrior had Equilibrium's healing and Inner Beast (which gave you 20% DR for 6 seconds and healed for 100% of the damage dealt).

In Stormblood it stayed pretty much the same but in 4.2 Warrior could now spam Inner Beast during IR to basically heal itself to full and Dark Knight's Sole Survivor was changed to provide healing even if the target didn't die.

Shadowbringers is where Dark Knight got the short end of the stick with Abyssal Drain being turned into a joke and Sole Survivor being removed completely, while Warrior got access to Nascent Flash which healed even more than it does now provided you knew how to do damage.

Which is why I honestly couldn't care less about tanks being able to solo dungeon bosses, it just takes a bit less effort now than in previous expansions, it's absolute faceroll content anyway.


What does need looking at imo is the overtuned party support.
Because while Warrior's selfhealing isn't all that impressive in content where it actually matters, the ability to provide that healing to your healers and dps, who already take no consistent damage, has a much bigger impact and unlike Paladin, Gunbreaker or Dark Knight you can provide that at barely any cost to yourself.

I came here to say exactly this. People complaining about tank survivability/self-sustain in the easiest, lowest-tier content the game has on offer either have the memory of a goldfish, or don't bother to touch anything more difficult than a story trial fight. Any tank with a skilled player at the helm can make up the difference against a dungeon boss when the healer goes down, and frankly, I would rather have that option on the table instead of a daily roulette run taking in excess of 30-40m (or worse, ending in failure) because the guy who queued on the other critical light party role isn't up to snuff.

There are entirely too many people running around in basic level 90 content with questionable competency, and I'm glad that job design in other areas, even if it's tuned specifically to handle high-end, covers these short-comings.

[Malthir]

Personally I think they should change oblations so it uses our darkside time. Something like
Oblation heals with a potency of 100 per 10s of Darkside burned to a maximum of 30s with 2 charges still and the 60s CD per charge/
This would engage with our class mechanics and give the Drk a much needed self heal IMO

That's leads into what I personally would like to see next expac, more use of our actual mech. I would like to see darkside go back to being a turn on mana drain for it's duration and then change our move sets so we add debuffs to enemies/hot's or barriers to ourselves at the expense of shortening Darksides time

[Oizen]

Mechanics in P10 and 11 are making me wish that Dark Missionary wasn't locked to only magic damage.

Seeing as they're so fine with Shake it off being as powerful as it is I don't see why this restriction is still needed.

[Shurrikhan]

I'd rather seen WAR/PLD self-healing/shielding (especially, per target) reined in (return BW/NF to the old Bloodbath design and revert the Divine Magic Mastery II buff) and then just buff Abyssal Drain OR give Salt and Darkness a self-heal. At most, also give a bit to Carve and Spit, and maybe move the healing from Souleater over to Bloodspiller (which we should then introduce at an earlier level). Done. We don't need tanks to be able to solo everything.

[ForsakenRoe]

DRK dungeon survivability is fine. It gives the healers the ability to do more than just spam their one aoe damage skill because they would actually have to heal the tank.

I can assure you that my one aoe damage skill is going to be getting fully exercised, regardless of what tank I end up with. I've had DRKs that are complete walls of HP, and WARs that eat the dirt faster than I can Excog em. 'Job effectiveness will vary with player skill' and all that