AST - Tips On Destroying Swords in " A Requiem for Heroes" ?

[ty_taurus]

I don’t recall saying he can’t AST. Stating that there are alternatives is not an attack or a demand.

Imagine a conversation that goes something like:

Person A: Are there going to be doughnuts at the cafe?
Person B: Yeah, but make sure you get there early cause they only make one batch in the morning.
Person C: There all also cookies available all day.

Is Person C being outlandishly unreasonable for stating there’s an alternative?

[Renathras]

...

/sigh

Imagine a conversation that goes something like:

Person A: Are there going to be doughnuts at the cafe? I'm trying to decide how I want to order a doughnut.
Person B: I'm surprised you'd subject yourself to eating doughnuts at a cafe. I guess here's how you could do it...
Person C: Having eaten doughnuts at the cafe, I can say literally anything other than doughnuts would be better than doughnuts.
Person A: But...I like doughn-
Person D: You can eat any of the other things on the menu, they're all better.
Person A: Well, thank you for the recommendation. Maybe I'll ask for sprinkles on my dough-
Person E: You know, there are other things you need for a balanced diet besides doughnuts...maybe you should consider ordering one of the other menu items? It'll be better for you in the long run.

Person F: Guys, he just wants a doughnut...

If it was just ONE of you saying it, sure. But after the second or third person? Let the man have his doughnut. If he wants one of the other menu items, he'll ask for recommendations. Person B (AnotherPerson) offered the quip, but then useful information. Roe also offered useful information.

.

I'm not going to say anything else about it, though. You do you, brother.

[ty_taurus]

Way to exaggerate the situation. Why do you always feel the need to attack others even when they’re making entirely respectful comments on the topic? If the OP feels offended, then let him say so.

If you didn’t want to say anything about it, then why did you write four paragraphs about it? You could’ve left well and good alone, but you brought it up when no one asked you to.

Not everyone knows about the role quests or the lore locked behind them. This thread reminded me of that, and I felt it would be helpful to know in advance. My comment about if you end up in another fight that has stopped your progress, you’d have alternatives to help get around that obstacle and be able to review the cutscenes as your preferred job after.

You hear me saying “There are cookies on the menu, and you should eat them instead. They’re better” which was the first thing I said way back when. Now, my comment was “if they’ve run out of doughnuts, you can still have the cookies. If you’re hungry for story, and the cafe is out of doughnuts, then you can always eat the cookie today and have the doughnut tomorrow.”

[Semirhage]

This thread is great. Someone came in with a question, and tons of advice and help was provided. Everything from "yeah AST is the hardest class to solo with, try making sure your Earthly Star timing is on point", to "check your gear", to "I went back in NG+ to check out the pain points for you", and definitely some "solo duties are pretty monotonous on healers and not really designed around them, they're definitely eaiser on the other roles. The soloing buff doesn't seem to increase your outgoing damage in a way that smooths the experience out in quite the same way that the gigantic regen does for DPS". Nary a "lol scrub just get better at the game" in sight

What a horrible, toxic subforum.

[ForsakenRoe]

Rather than interpreting it all as 'AST struggles the most with solo content because of it's low damage, so do it as literally any other job', like Ren assumes everyone is implying, I'd rather think of it as 'AST struggles the most with solo content because of it's low damage, so beating it even with the odds stacked against you because of this makes it even more rewarding to kick it's ass'

Then again, as I've mentioned multiple times in multiple threads, I'm in the habit of 'believing in the nascent potential of the new player' rather than assuming they 'just can't do it' for whatever reason. Wonder if they ever beat it

You hear me saying “There are cookies on the menu, and you should eat them instead. They’re better” which was the first thing I said way back when. Now, my comment was “if they’ve run out of doughnuts, you can still have the cookies. If you’re hungry for story, and the cafe is out of doughnuts, then you can always eat the cookie today and have the doughnut tomorrow.”

First it was curry, then hot wings, now it's doughnuts and cookies. You guys are making a full episode of Hell's Kitchen or something here, what's next, ice cream sundaes? Milkshakes?

[ty_taurus]

Rather than interpreting it all as 'AST struggles the most with solo content because of it's low damage, so do it as literally any other job', like Ren assumes everyone is implying, I'd rather think of it as 'AST struggles the most with solo content because of it's low damage, so beating it even with the odds stacked against you because of this makes it even more rewarding to kick it's ass'

Then again, as I've mentioned multiple times in multiple threads, I'm in the habit of 'believing in the nascent potential of the new player' rather than assuming they 'just can't do it' for whatever reason. Wonder if they ever beat it



First it was curry, then hot wings, now it's doughnuts and cookies. You guys are making a full episode of Hell's Kitchen or something here, what's next, ice cream sundaes? Milkshakes?

Analogies like these tend to work with children at least.

[IDontPetLalas]

I don't mean this harshly, because I know you're being well meaning, but some people want to play the content on their Healer. The poster already said he wants to do it on AST. Everyone trying to coax him into leveling as something else is missing that point. I do MSQ on Healers. I just finished doing the last sidequests in the game (all the random world ones) tonight, and did it on SCH and AST (did AST for a bit to see if it was really any slower. Far as I can tell, not really. I MIGHT get one more Malific cast in before things die, but I'm not even sure, and it wasn't noticable), because I like playing Healers even in solo content.

Besides, if you're talking about Role quests, players can get a Tank at 60 (GNB), Melee at 70 (RPR), Ranged at 60 (DNC), and Caster at 50 (RDM, and probably the next expansion will give one at 80)

If the guy likes AST, let him AST. He's gotten tips and seems determined, and we know it's possible. Let him do it. If he wants to pick up or level another Job, he's aware that's an option by now, so no further coaxing is necessary nor desired. Again, I'm genuinely trying to be gentle in how I say this, because I know you mean the best - as does Nizzi:



IDontPetLalas:



And AnotherPerson:



I suspect you genuinely mean well, and maybe you didn't see Rollind's post in another thread (he said in another one he really wants to do this stuff on AST), but I don't think it's constructive for EVERYone to tell a person to play a different Job, especially when he seems to want to do the content on THIS Job...

.

Anyway, I won't say anymore on it, since I think the intent is genuine benevolence, but I think at this point, he's aware of that option.

Expressing your opinion is one thing, disagreeing with any opinion expressed by anyone else on the forum is another BUT if OP has an issue with any of our posts I have faith that he/she/they will be able to communicate that. I don't need or want you to interpret my posts on behalf of someone else, we have an official moderator for that, should you ever feel that I have crossed the line there are existing features for you to communicate with them. You are out of line once you take on this imaginary forum cop/ forum psychiatrist role.

[Renathras]

Way to exaggerate the situation.

That's what you're doing, though...? I was correcting your (rather biased and incorrect) analogy with a correct one.

Why do you always feel the need to attack others

I DIDN'T.

I know you don't read my posts, so I'll quote it for you here:

I don't mean this harshly, because I know you're being well meaning, but some people want to play the content on their Healer.
...
Again, I'm genuinely trying to be gentle in how I say this, because I know you mean the best - as does Nizzi:
...
IDontPetLalas:
...
And AnotherPerson:
...
I suspect you genuinely mean well, and maybe you didn't see Rollind's post in another thread (he said in another one he really wants to do this stuff on AST), but I don't think it's constructive for EVERYone to tell a person to play a different Job, especially when he seems to want to do the content on THIS Job...
...
Anyway, I won't say anymore on it, since I think the intent is genuine benevolence, but I think at this point, he's aware of that option.

Which part of that was an "attack"?

Indeed, I said MULTIPLE times there that I thought you guys were well meaning and acting with genuine benevolence.

That's a complement, not an attack.

This is one of the things so frustrating about this place. Even when I agree with or complement you guys, you perceive it as an attack.

You're bringing up things when no one's asking you to. How come you get that privilege but deny me it?

Yes, not everyone knows about the Role Quests, but your argument was a carrot and stick attempt to get OP to reconsider doing content on his Healer Job. And as I noted, the OP can easily do that later if OP wants to, since there are ready access to Jobs - which I included which Jobs and what levels.

And your analogy is still incorrect: They haven't run out of doughnuts. There are perfectly good doughnuts right there. Not to mention that even if we bought your premise - that OP needs to level alt Jobs for the Role Quests - this still means he needs to level a Healer, so why not do that first since it's what he wants?

What a horrible, toxic subforum.

Honestly, I've largely praised this thread. It's an unusual case of this subforum doing what it's actually supposed to - discussing tactics related to using a Healer for a piece of content. (Though I would note all the "You should play a different Job" could be considered by some people a bit toxic, especially after the person made clear they do not want to...but since this is closer than most to actually NOT being a toxic thread, maybe it can slide?)

Rather than interpreting it all as 'AST struggles the most with solo content because of it's low damage, so do it as literally any other job', like Ren assumes everyone is implying, I'd rather think of it as 'AST struggles the most with solo content because of it's low damage, so beating it even with the odds stacked against you because of this makes it even more rewarding to kick it's ass'

I feel this would be a good take, but clearly it isn't the take here. If it was, I wouldn't have said anything.

As for the analogies: Blame Ty for that. He likes coming up with analogies but ones that don't even fit the situation and paint one side in a light that it isn't.

Expressing your opinion is one thing, disagreeing with any opinion expressed by anyone else on the forum is another BUT if OP has an issue with any of our posts I have faith that he/she/they will be able to communicate that. I don't need or want you to interpret my posts on behalf of someone else, we have an official moderator for that, should you ever feel that I have crossed the line there are existing features for you to communicate with them. You are out of line once you take on this imaginary forum cop/ forum psychiatrist role.

Most people aren't confrontational. Blame this on military training on not being a bystander. One too many trainings of "If you're in a bar and have a female friend trying to politely decline advances where the advancer either doesn't seem to get it or isn't listening, step in on their behalf." Many people, especially new to a group or situation, are not assertive.

In any case, I made the point: If the person wanted to pick a different Job, they would have. They know the option is there after the first several people said it. They don't need to keep being told it in different ways to try to coax them into doing it. Just let them play as they wish.

But I also said in absolute terms I didn't think any of you were being malevolent about it.

THIS is more an example of how toxic this place is - where even when I'm complementing you, I get no less than four separate posters attacking me...over complementing them. <_<

.

Take the damn complement and let the man have his doughtnut!

[ty_taurus]

This is one of the things so frustrating about this place. Even when I agree with or complement you guys, you perceive it as an attack.

But the thing is, you often do not just compliment someone, you provide a backhanded compliment. 'I know you mean well, but here's three paragraphs on why you're actually being a bother.' is not a compliment. It also wasn't a topic directed at you. Let the man fight his own battles if he felt it was an invasive piece of information. Many new players do not know about the role quest merged storyline until informed about it. Knowing that sooner rather than later is not something that was discussed earlier in this thread. Additionally, the point about having other jobs to be able to swap into for instance battles was something that in my post I specified was a bonus point that he would have the option to do if he felt like it. Having the job already leveled gives you that option without needing to go back and spend several days grinding up a job you don't have leveled up. That way, at his discretion, he has that choice available at his finger tips. Not once in that post did I say "And additionally you can play something way better, stronger, and more fun than AST which you should give up on" or anything along the lines of telling someone not to play something.

[Renathras]

...

You do realize many people WON'T speak up in their own defense, right?

And I often DO complement, much more so than...well, never mind. Doesn't matter anyway. /shrug

Anyway, I said what I needed to say, you do you.